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interests / soc.culture.china / Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fascists" in Russia

SubjectAuthor
* Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fasciA. Filip
`* Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT seesltlee1
 +* Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. StanleyA. Filip
 |`* Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russialtlee1
 | +- Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. StanleyA. Filip
 | `* Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russialtlee1
 |  `* Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russiabmoore
 |   `- Re: Russia-Ukraine v. PRC-Taiwan [Was: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYTA. Filip
 `- Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT seesbmoore

1
Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fascists" in Russia

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From: anf...@wp.eu (A. Filip)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fascists" in Russia
Date: Sat, 21 May 2022 04:23:39 +0000 (UTC)
Organization: It is for me to know and for you to find out.
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 by: A. Filip - Sat, 21 May 2022 04:23 UTC

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
> Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the author
> of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European history. […]

Be aware of militant "antifascists" *even without tanks*.

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| Anyone who imagines that all fruits ripen at the same time as the
| strawberries, knows nothing about grapes. (Philippus Paracelsus)

Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fascists" in Russia

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Subject: Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees
fascists/"fascists" in Russia
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Sun, 22 May 2022 09:21 UTC

On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the author
> > of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European history. […]
>

Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University,
"People disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s Russia
meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has a cult around a single leader,
Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World
War II. It has a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."

Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University,
"But the core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to privilege a
single ethnic group."
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism

> Be aware of militant "antifascists" *even without tanks*.
>

Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA

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From: anf...@wp.eu (A. Filip)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA
Date: Sun, 22 May 2022 10:43:17 +0000 (UTC)
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 by: A. Filip - Sun, 22 May 2022 10:43 UTC

ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
>> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
>> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
>> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
>> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the
>> > author of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European
>> > history. […]
>> […]
>
> Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University, "People
> disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s
> Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has
> a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the
> dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has
> a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
>
> Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University, "But the
> core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to
> privilege a single ethnic group."
> https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism

As I understand you "believe" in words of both Yale professors, don't you?
One Yale professor is quite like another ;-)

It is fun you use/abuse quotes from "battles of yesterday".
Truths of today may put in another light by truths of yesterday.
Be aware of people with too good memory ;-)

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| "May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house."
| (George Carlin)

Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA

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Subject: Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia
v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Sun, 22 May 2022 12:39 UTC

On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 6:46:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> >> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
> >> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> >> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> >> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the
> >> > author of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European
> >> > history. […]
> >> […]
> >
> > Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University, "People
> > disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s
> > Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has
> > a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the
> > dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has
> > a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
> >
> > Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University, "But the
> > core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to
> > privilege a single ethnic group."
> > https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism
> As I understand you "believe" in words of both Yale professors, don't you?
> One Yale professor is quite like another ;-)

Not at all.
The difference may depend on whether one sees fascism is an "ontic" object or
an ontological object.
>
> It is fun you use/abuse quotes from "battles of yesterday".
> Truths of today may put in another light by truths of yesterday.
> Be aware of people with too good memory ;-)

You may as well apply the above to the Professor of History.

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From: anf...@wp.eu (A. Filip)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA
Date: Sun, 22 May 2022 13:18:23 +0000 (UTC)
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 by: A. Filip - Sun, 22 May 2022 13:18 UTC

ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 6:46:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
>> ltlee1 wrote:
>> > On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
>> >> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
>> >> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
>> >> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
>> >> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the
>> >> > author of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European
>> >> > history. […]
>> >> […]
>> >
>> > Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University, "People
>> > disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s
>> > Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has
>> > a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the
>> > dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has
>> > a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
>> >
>> > Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University, "But the
>> > core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to
>> > privilege a single ethnic group."
>> > https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism
>> As I understand you "believe" in words of both Yale professors, don't you?
>> One Yale professor is quite like another ;-)
>
> Not at all.
> The difference may depend on whether one sees fascism is an "ontic" object or
> an ontological object.
>
>> It is fun you use/abuse quotes from "battles of yesterday".
>> Truths of today may put in another light by truths of yesterday.
>> Be aware of people with too good memory ;-)
>
> You may as well apply the above to the Professor of History.

History teachers I have met mostly remembered politically current
version of history. I can remember only *ONE* person exception.

Remembering in silence is almost like social forgetting.

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| I'm a soldier, not a diplomat. I can only tell the truth.
| (Kirk, "Errand of Mercy", stardate 3198.9)

Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees fascists/"fascists" in Russia

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Subject: Re: Putin fights "fascist"/fascists in Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT sees
fascists/"fascists" in Russia
From: bmo...@nyx.net (bmoore)
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 by: bmoore - Sun, 22 May 2022 14:20 UTC

On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 2:21:59 AM UTC-7, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin..html
> > > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> > > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> > > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the author
> > > of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European history. […]
> >
> Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University,
> "People disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s Russia
> meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has a cult around a single leader,
> Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World
> War II. It has a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
>
> Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University,
> "But the core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to privilege a
> single ethnic group."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_chauvinism

> https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism
> > Be aware of militant "antifascists" *even without tanks*.
> >

Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA

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Subject: Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia
v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Mon, 23 May 2022 14:08 UTC

On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 8:39:32 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 6:46:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > ltlee1 wrote:
> > > On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > >> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
> > >> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> > >> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> > >> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the
> > >> > author of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European
> > >> > history. […]
> > >> […]
> > >
> > > Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University, "People
> > > disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s
> > > Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has
> > > a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the
> > > dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has
> > > a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
> > >
> > > Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University, "But the
> > > core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to
> > > privilege a single ethnic group."
> > > https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism
> > As I understand you "believe" in words of both Yale professors, don't you?
> > One Yale professor is quite like another ;-)
> Not at all.
> The difference may depend on whether one sees fascism is an "ontic" object or
> an ontological object.

If one wears the ontological hat, then what it is clear that Ukraine had changed the law to
discriminate against Russian speaking Ukrainian citizens. BTW, the change had triggered
human rights group complaints.

> >
> > It is fun you use/abuse quotes from "battles of yesterday".
> > Truths of today may put in another light by truths of yesterday.
> > Be aware of people with too good memory ;-)
> You may as well apply the above to the Professor of History.

Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA

<a4261d82-5a2b-42cb-88f9-15901e86959an@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia
v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA
From: bmo...@nyx.net (bmoore)
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 by: bmoore - Mon, 23 May 2022 22:11 UTC

On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 7:08:15 AM UTC-7, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 8:39:32 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 6:46:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > > ltlee1 wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 12:24:29 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > > >> https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
> > > >> > Opinion Guest Essay "We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist." ;
> > > >> > May 19, 2022 By Timothy Snyder ;
> > > >> > Dr. Snyder is a professor of history at Yale University and the
> > > >> > author of many books on fascism, totalitarianism and European
> > > >> > history. […]
> > > >> […]
> > > >
> > > > Timothy Synder, Professor of History at Yale University, "People
> > > > disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s
> > > > Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has
> > > > a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the
> > > > dead, It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has
> > > > a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness..."
> > > >
> > > > Jason Stanley, Professor of Philosophy at Yale University, "But the
> > > > core of fascist ideology is realised in changing citizenship laws to
> > > > privilege a single ethnic group."
> > > > https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/24/trump-modi-citizenship-politics-fascism
> > > As I understand you "believe" in words of both Yale professors, don't you?
> > > One Yale professor is quite like another ;-)
> > Not at all.
> > The difference may depend on whether one sees fascism is an "ontic" object or
> > an ontological object.
> If one wears the ontological hat, then what it is clear that Ukraine had changed the law to
> discriminate against Russian speaking Ukrainian citizens. BTW, the change had triggered
> human rights group complaints.

Which completely justifies invading a sovereign nation, and killing and raping civilians?

Q: How come you refuse to acknowledge that truth?

A: Taiwan.

> > >
> > > It is fun you use/abuse quotes from "battles of yesterday".
> > > Truths of today may put in another light by truths of yesterday.
> > > Be aware of people with too good memory ;-)
> > You may as well apply the above to the Professor of History.

Re: Russia-Ukraine v. PRC-Taiwan [Was: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA]

<anfi+ai4ojpzz5f-m5n1@wp.eu>

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Subject: Re: Russia-Ukraine v. PRC-Taiwan [Was: Putin: "fascist" Ukraine v. Snyder at NYT: "fascist" Putin-Russia v. Stanley: "fascist" Trump-USA]
Date: Mon, 23 May 2022 23:12:08 +0000 (UTC)
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 by: A. Filip - Mon, 23 May 2022 23:12 UTC

bmoore <bmoore@nyx.net> wrote:
> On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 7:08:15 AM UTC-7, ltlee1 wrote:
[…]
>> If one wears the ontological hat, then what it is clear that Ukraine had changed the law to
>> discriminate against Russian speaking Ukrainian citizens. BTW, the change had triggered
>> human rights group complaints.
>
> Which completely justifies invading a sovereign nation, and killing
> and raping civilians?
> Q: How come you refuse to acknowledge that truth?
> A: Taiwan.
> […]

When did Taiwan abandon "One (ROC) China" policy? The date changes
not so much but "fear" to give *full* picture changes a lot.
<irony> PRC as much stronger is less willing (slower) to abandon it's
mirror "One (PRC) China" policy. </irony>

I do not support "re-integrating" Taiwan without Taiwanese consent
(referendum). Post factum referendum does not count.

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| A fox is a wolf who sends flowers. (Ruth Weston)

1
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