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interests / soc.culture.china / Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

SubjectAuthor
* Why So Many Democracies Are Flounderingltlee1
+* Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Flounderingltlee1
|`* Re: Why So Many Democracies Are FlounderingJedi Master
| `- Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Flounderingltlee1
`- Re: Why So Many Democracies Are FlounderingDavid P.

1
Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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Subject: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Thu, 30 Dec 2021 14:08 UTC

"...the most pervasive and perhaps deepest challenge facing virtually all Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics.

Political fragmentation is the dispersion of political power into so many different hands and centers of power that it becomes difficult for democratic governments to function effectively.

President Biden has recognized this historic challenge...

Yet even with unified control of government, the internal divisions of the Democratic Party postponed passage of his bipartisan infrastructure bill for several months and have made it uncertain which parts, if any, of the Build Back Better proposal will be enacted.

When democratic governments seem incapable of delivering on their promises, this failure can lead to alienation, resignation, distrust and withdrawal among many citizens. It can also trigger demands for authoritarian leaders who promise to cut through messy politics. At an even greater extreme, it can lead people to question democracy itself and become open to anti-democratic systems of government.

The struggle of the Biden administration to deliver on its policy agenda offers a good example of the political fragmentation of politics taking place throughout Western democracies. It takes different forms in the multiparty systems of Europe and the two-party system of the United States. The European democracies are experiencing the unraveling of the traditionally dominant center-left and center-right major parties and coalitions that have governed since World War II. ...

The effects on the ability to govern have been dramatic. In Germany, the stable anchor of Europe since the 1950s, the two major parties regularly used to receive over 90 percent of the vote combined; in this fall’s elections, that plummeted to less than 50 percent. Support has hemorrhaged to green, anti-immigrant, free-market and other parties. After its 2017 elections, with support fragmented among many parties, it took Germany six months to cobble together a governing coalition, the longest time in the country’s history. The Netherlands, after its 2017 elections, needed a record 225 days to form a government.
....
Large structural forces have driven the fragmentation of politics throughout the West. On the economic front, the forces include globalization’s contribution to the stagnation of middle- and working-class incomes, rising inequality and outrage over the 2008 financial crisis. On the cultural side: conflicts over immigration, nationalism and other issues.
....
The communications revolution is also a major force generating the disabling fragmentation of politics. Across Europe, it has given rise to loosely organized, leaderless protest movements that disrupt politics and give birth to other parties — but make effective government harder to achieve.

In the United States, the new communications era has enabled the rise of free-agent politicians. A Congress with more free agents is more difficult to govern. ...

Through cable television and social media, they can find and construct their own national constituencies. Through internet fund-raising (particularly small donations), politicians (particularly from the extremes) can become effective fund-raising machines on their own. "

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/29/opinion/democracy-fragmentation-america-europe.html

Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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Subject: Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Sat, 1 Jan 2022 19:48 UTC

On Thursday, December 30, 2021 at 2:08:34 PM UTC, ltlee1 wrote:
> "...the most pervasive and perhaps deepest challenge facing virtually all Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics.
>
> Political fragmentation is the dispersion of political power into so many different hands and centers of power that it becomes difficult for democratic governments to function effectively.
>
> President Biden has recognized this historic challenge...
>
> Yet even with unified control of government, the internal divisions of the Democratic Party postponed passage of his bipartisan infrastructure bill for several months and have made it uncertain which parts, if any, of the Build Back Better proposal will be enacted.
>
> When democratic governments seem incapable of delivering on their promises, this failure can lead to alienation, resignation, distrust and withdrawal among many citizens. It can also trigger demands for authoritarian leaders who promise to cut through messy politics. At an even greater extreme, it can lead people to question democracy itself and become open to anti-democratic systems of government.
>
> The struggle of the Biden administration to deliver on its policy agenda offers a good example of the political fragmentation of politics taking place throughout Western democracies. It takes different forms in the multiparty systems of Europe and the two-party system of the United States. The European democracies are experiencing the unraveling of the traditionally dominant center-left and center-right major parties and coalitions that have governed since World War II. ...
>
> The effects on the ability to govern have been dramatic. In Germany, the stable anchor of Europe since the 1950s, the two major parties regularly used to receive over 90 percent of the vote combined; in this fall’s elections, that plummeted to less than 50 percent. Support has hemorrhaged to green, anti-immigrant, free-market and other parties. After its 2017 elections, with support fragmented among many parties, it took Germany six months to cobble together a governing coalition, the longest time in the country’s history. The Netherlands, after its 2017 elections, needed a record 225 days to form a government.
> ...
> Large structural forces have driven the fragmentation of politics throughout the West. On the economic front, the forces include globalization’s contribution to the stagnation of middle- and working-class incomes, rising inequality and outrage over the 2008 financial crisis. On the cultural side: conflicts over immigration, nationalism and other issues.
> ...
> The communications revolution is also a major force generating the disabling fragmentation of politics. Across Europe, it has given rise to loosely organized, leaderless protest movements that disrupt politics and give birth to other parties — but make effective government harder to achieve.
>
> In the United States, the new communications era has enabled the rise of free-agent politicians. A Congress with more free agents is more difficult to govern. ...
>
> Through cable television and social media, they can find and construct their own national constituencies. Through internet fund-raising (particularly small donations), politicians (particularly from the extremes) can become effective fund-raising machines on their own. "
>
> https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/29/opinion/democracy-fragmentation-america-europe.html

"Mr. Pildes has spent his career as a legal scholar analyzing the intersection of politics and law and
how they affect our democracy."
He is certainly correct in pointing out the obvious. That is " the deepest challenge facing virtually all
Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics. "

But political fragmentation is a built-in structural part of Western democracy. How else could a nation
has competitive multiple parties without political fragmentation? Yes, one could point to Japan where
one party has managed to rule most of its post WWII history.

More recently, Bloomberg had publish the following article showcasing Japan's one party rule:
"Japan is a one-party state again and voters are fine with that." But then those parties are not
competitive. Neither is Japan's economy. It has consecutive lost decades.

"The term [lost decade] originally referred to the years from 1991 to 2001, but the decade from 2001 to 2011
and the decade from 2011 to 2021 have been included by commentators." (Wikapedia)

Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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Subject: Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering
From: cybernet...@gmail.com (Jedi Master)
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 by: Jedi Master - Sat, 1 Jan 2022 23:47 UTC

On Saturday, January 1, 2022 at 9:48:04 AM UTC-10, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Thursday, December 30, 2021 at 2:08:34 PM UTC, ltlee1 wrote:
> > "...the most pervasive and perhaps deepest challenge facing virtually all Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics.
> >
> > Political fragmentation is the dispersion of political power into so many different hands and centers of power that it becomes difficult for democratic governments to function effectively.
> >
> > President Biden has recognized this historic challenge...
> >
> > Yet even with unified control of government, the internal divisions of the Democratic Party postponed passage of his bipartisan infrastructure bill for several months and have made it uncertain which parts, if any, of the Build Back Better proposal will be enacted.
> >
> > When democratic governments seem incapable of delivering on their promises, this failure can lead to alienation, resignation, distrust and withdrawal among many citizens. It can also trigger demands for authoritarian leaders who promise to cut through messy politics. At an even greater extreme, it can lead people to question democracy itself and become open to anti-democratic systems of government.
> >
> > The struggle of the Biden administration to deliver on its policy agenda offers a good example of the political fragmentation of politics taking place throughout Western democracies. It takes different forms in the multiparty systems of Europe and the two-party system of the United States. The European democracies are experiencing the unraveling of the traditionally dominant center-left and center-right major parties and coalitions that have governed since World War II. ...
> >
> > The effects on the ability to govern have been dramatic. In Germany, the stable anchor of Europe since the 1950s, the two major parties regularly used to receive over 90 percent of the vote combined; in this fall’s elections, that plummeted to less than 50 percent. Support has hemorrhaged to green, anti-immigrant, free-market and other parties. After its 2017 elections, with support fragmented among many parties, it took Germany six months to cobble together a governing coalition, the longest time in the country’s history. The Netherlands, after its 2017 elections, needed a record 225 days to form a government.
> > ...
> > Large structural forces have driven the fragmentation of politics throughout the West. On the economic front, the forces include globalization’s contribution to the stagnation of middle- and working-class incomes, rising inequality and outrage over the 2008 financial crisis. On the cultural side: conflicts over immigration, nationalism and other issues.
> > ...
> > The communications revolution is also a major force generating the disabling fragmentation of politics. Across Europe, it has given rise to loosely organized, leaderless protest movements that disrupt politics and give birth to other parties — but make effective government harder to achieve.
> >
> > In the United States, the new communications era has enabled the rise of free-agent politicians. A Congress with more free agents is more difficult to govern. ...
> >
> > Through cable television and social media, they can find and construct their own national constituencies. Through internet fund-raising (particularly small donations), politicians (particularly from the extremes) can become effective fund-raising machines on their own. "
> >
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/29/opinion/democracy-fragmentation-america-europe.html
> "Mr. Pildes has spent his career as a legal scholar analyzing the intersection of politics and law and
> how they affect our democracy."
> He is certainly correct in pointing out the obvious. That is " the deepest challenge facing virtually all
> Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics. "
> But political fragmentation is a built-in structural part of Western democracy. How else could a nation
> has competitive multiple parties without political fragmentation? Yes, one could point to Japan where
> one party has managed to rule most of its post WWII history.
>
> More recently, Bloomberg had publish the following article showcasing Japan's one party rule:
> "Japan is a one-party state again and voters are fine with that." But then those parties are not
> competitive. Neither is Japan's economy. It has consecutive lost decades.
>
> "The term [lost decade] originally referred to the years from 1991 to 2001, but the decade from 2001 to 2011
> and the decade from 2011 to 2021 have been included by commentators." (Wikapedia)

Democracy or government of the people, by the people, and for the people is based on checks and balances of arbitrary government power as opposed to government one party dictatorship and totalitarianism. Government by consent of the governed is the safeguard people have against falling in the abyss of tyranny like communists do on a daily basis.

Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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Subject: Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering
From: imb...@mindspring.com (David P.)
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 by: David P. - Sun, 2 Jan 2022 00:06 UTC

ltlee1 wrote:
> "...the most pervasive and perhaps deepest challenge facing virtually
> all Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics.
----------
No, the big problem is failure to control population; the same reason
why China is floundering!
...
...

Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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Subject: Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering
From: ltl...@hotmail.com (ltlee1)
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 by: ltlee1 - Sun, 2 Jan 2022 21:35 UTC

On Saturday, January 1, 2022 at 11:47:44 PM UTC, Jedi Master wrote:
> On Saturday, January 1, 2022 at 9:48:04 AM UTC-10, ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 30, 2021 at 2:08:34 PM UTC, ltlee1 wrote:
> > > "...the most pervasive and perhaps deepest challenge facing virtually all Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics.
> > >
> > > Political fragmentation is the dispersion of political power into so many different hands and centers of power that it becomes difficult for democratic governments to function effectively.
> > >
> > > President Biden has recognized this historic challenge...
> > >
> > > Yet even with unified control of government, the internal divisions of the Democratic Party postponed passage of his bipartisan infrastructure bill for several months and have made it uncertain which parts, if any, of the Build Back Better proposal will be enacted.
> > >
> > > When democratic governments seem incapable of delivering on their promises, this failure can lead to alienation, resignation, distrust and withdrawal among many citizens. It can also trigger demands for authoritarian leaders who promise to cut through messy politics. At an even greater extreme, it can lead people to question democracy itself and become open to anti-democratic systems of government.
> > >
> > > The struggle of the Biden administration to deliver on its policy agenda offers a good example of the political fragmentation of politics taking place throughout Western democracies. It takes different forms in the multiparty systems of Europe and the two-party system of the United States. The European democracies are experiencing the unraveling of the traditionally dominant center-left and center-right major parties and coalitions that have governed since World War II. ...
> > >
> > > The effects on the ability to govern have been dramatic. In Germany, the stable anchor of Europe since the 1950s, the two major parties regularly used to receive over 90 percent of the vote combined; in this fall’s elections, that plummeted to less than 50 percent. Support has hemorrhaged to green, anti-immigrant, free-market and other parties. After its 2017 elections, with support fragmented among many parties, it took Germany six months to cobble together a governing coalition, the longest time in the country’s history. The Netherlands, after its 2017 elections, needed a record 225 days to form a government.
> > > ...
> > > Large structural forces have driven the fragmentation of politics throughout the West. On the economic front, the forces include globalization’s contribution to the stagnation of middle- and working-class incomes, rising inequality and outrage over the 2008 financial crisis. On the cultural side: conflicts over immigration, nationalism and other issues.
> > > ...
> > > The communications revolution is also a major force generating the disabling fragmentation of politics. Across Europe, it has given rise to loosely organized, leaderless protest movements that disrupt politics and give birth to other parties — but make effective government harder to achieve.
> > >
> > > In the United States, the new communications era has enabled the rise of free-agent politicians. A Congress with more free agents is more difficult to govern. ...
> > >
> > > Through cable television and social media, they can find and construct their own national constituencies. Through internet fund-raising (particularly small donations), politicians (particularly from the extremes) can become effective fund-raising machines on their own. "
> > >
> > > https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/29/opinion/democracy-fragmentation-america-europe.html
> > "Mr. Pildes has spent his career as a legal scholar analyzing the intersection of politics and law and
> > how they affect our democracy."
> > He is certainly correct in pointing out the obvious. That is " the deepest challenge facing virtually all
> > Western democracies today is the political fragmentation of democratic politics. "
> > But political fragmentation is a built-in structural part of Western democracy. How else could a nation
> > has competitive multiple parties without political fragmentation? Yes, one could point to Japan where
> > one party has managed to rule most of its post WWII history.
> >
> > More recently, Bloomberg had publish the following article showcasing Japan's one party rule:
> > "Japan is a one-party state again and voters are fine with that." But then those parties are not
> > competitive. Neither is Japan's economy. It has consecutive lost decades.
> >
> > "The term [lost decade] originally referred to the years from 1991 to 2001, but the decade from 2001 to 2011
> > and the decade from 2011 to 2021 have been included by commentators." (Wikapedia)

> Democracy or government of the people, by the people, and for the people is based on checks and balances of arbitrary government power as opposed to government one party dictatorship and totalitarianism. Government by consent of the governed is the safeguard people have against falling in the abyss of tyranny like communists do on a daily basis.

Rasmussen Poll had carried out multiple surveys on one issue. Whether the US government, supposely
a democracy, has the consent of the government. 3 out of 4 likely voters answered negatively across the
surveys. That is, the US government did not govern with the consent of the people. WHY?


interests / soc.culture.china / Re: Why So Many Democracies Are Floundering

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