OT

I'mt thinking of aall those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.

Maybe White Russia too.

On 2/23/2024 12:25 PM, micky wrote:
> OT
>
> I'mt thinking of aall those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
> Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
> also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
> their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
> danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
> big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.
>
> Maybe White Russia too.

You are missing the boat on that one and still believe the Trump/Russia
collusion lies.

Trump is not a politician and his comment about maybe the Russians had
Hillary's emails since the FBI did not have them was sarcastic but
misconstrued as proof of collusion with Russia.

Same with his recent NATO comments as previously he had pointed out that
they were lacking in their contributions, got better and then lapsed
back under Biden.

Maybe a politician could have stated these things better.

My mother's parents were Lithuanians and you know how I feel.

On 2024-02-23, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
> OT
>
> I'mt thinking of aall those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
> Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
> also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
> their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
> danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
> big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.
>
> Maybe White Russia too.

Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
AFAIK.

In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
probably more so.

Ed? What's the Polish take on this?

--
Cindy Hamilton

In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
says...
>
> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
> AFAIK.
>
> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
> probably more so.
>
>

I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
dads side. I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
American and want what is best for America first and if there is
anything left over then help the other countries.

Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes when Russia promised not to
invade and other countries promised to protect them.

As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
that don't.

On 2/23/2024 4:54 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On 2024-02-23, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>> OT
>>
>> I'mt thinking of aall those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
>> Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
>> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
>> also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
>> their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
>> danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
>> big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.
>>
>> Maybe White Russia too.
>
> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
> AFAIK.
>
> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
> probably more so.
>
> Ed? What's the Polish take on this?
>

Most Polish despise Russia and what they are doing. Any one could be
easily take over by Russia if they fought alone.

I don't have any direct connection to Ukraine but want to see them
survive. If they don't, what is next? Putin is one step below Hitler
and given the opportunity, he may pick away at every bordering country.

micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote

> I'm thinking of all those Americans whohave family roots in Estonia,
> Latvia, Lituania,

That's not really eastern europe.

> Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans,but I would
> also think the great majority care about whathappens to the country
> their ancestors lived in.

Really depends on how long ago their ancestors migrated to the USA.

> If they can be convinced that Russia is a danger

That would be diffiicult given that it isnt really given NATO.

> and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger,

Much harder with that.

> I would expect a big percent of the Republicansto vote Democratic in
> the fall.

Cant see it myself.

> Maybe White Russia too.

Those are much more recent generally.

Frank <"frank "@frank.net> wrote
> micky wrote

>> I'm thinking of all those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
>> Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
>> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
>> also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
>> their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
>> danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
>> big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.
>> Maybe White Russia too.

> You are missing the boat on that one

Yes.

> and still believe the Trump/Russia collusion lies.

While he overstated the accomplice claim, there as clear
collusion, particularly with Trump's pandering to Putin
so make it more likely that Putin would allow Trump to
do stuff in Russia after he was nolonger Prez.

Its not at all clear if Trump still wants to do that given the
sanctions which are unlikely to be removed any time soon.

Certainly Trump is unlikely to be in favor of the same
level of support for the Ukraine as Biden, but it isnt
really the Prez that matters as far as that is concerned.

Its far from clear what will happen with Congress come November.

> Trump is not a politician

Of course he is.

> and his comment about maybe the Russians had Hillary'semails since the
> FBI did not have them was sarcastic but misconstrued as proof of
> collusion with Russia.

That was a minor part of what indicated Trump's pandering to Putin.

> Same with his recent NATO comments as previously he had pointed out that
> they were lacking in their contributions, got better and then lapsed
> back under Biden.

That had nothing to do with any US president.

It was actually about Putin's invasion of the
Ukraine and it has not lapsted back either.

> Maybe a politician could have stated these things better.

> My mother's parents were Lithuanians and you know how I feel.

On Sat, 24 Feb 2024 09:14:40 +1100, Ralph Mowery <rmowery42@charter.net>
wrote:

> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
> says...
>>
>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>> AFAIK.
>>
>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>> probably more so.

> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany

I can too, at least in theory given that that grand dad
did migrate from east germany via the RSA, but when
his wife, my grandmother died much later than him,
it turned out that he married my grandmother quite
literally on the day before my mother was born and
so it is not certain that he actually is my grandfather
and I havent bothered to get a DNA test to prove that.

> but have no idea about my dads side.

I do, absolutely certainly english.

> I could care less about any of the countries

Yeah, I have never considered that question
Micky raised before at all. Certainly my dad
never had any problem with marrying my
mother during the war when he was stationed
very close to where my mother's parents lived
so he knew about her father who wasnt even
interned during the war.

> as I am an American and want what is best for America firstand if there
> is anything left over then help the other countries.

Me too, tho not america in my case.

> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes when Russia promisednot to
> invade and other countries promised to protect them.

Yep.

> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
> that don't.

That has never happened.

On Sat, 24 Feb 2024 13:22:37 +1100, Ed P <esp@snet.xxx> wrote:

> On 2/23/2024 4:54 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>> On 2024-02-23, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>>> OT
>>>
>>> I'mt thinking of aall those Americans who have family roots in Estonia,
>>> Latvia, Lituania, Poland, Slovakia, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
>>> Moldova. I would suppose some of them are Republicans, but I would
>>> also think the great majority care about what happens to the country
>>> their ancestors lived in. If they can be convinced that Russia is a
>>> danger and that trump is an acccomplice to the danger, I would expect a
>>> big percent of the Republicans to vote Democratic in the fall.
>>>
>>> Maybe White Russia too.
>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>> AFAIK.
>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>> probably more so.
>> Ed? What's the Polish take on this?
>>
>
> Most Polish despise Russia and what they are doing. Any one could be
> easily take over by Russia if they fought alone.

Didnt happen with Georgia,

> I don't have any direct connection to Ukraine but want to see them
> survive. If they don't, what is next? Putin is one step below Hitler
> and given the opportunity, he may pick away at every bordering country.

Not even possible given that almost all that matter are part of NATO now.

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 09:27:29 +1100,cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
pamela about Rodent Speed:
"His off the cuff expertise demonstrates how little he knows..."
MID: <XnsA90B720A381A2D4AM2@81.171.92.183>

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 09:36:15 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
Richard addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"Shit you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID: <ogoa38$pul$1@news.mixmin.net>

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 09:38:27 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
Hawk addressing the obnoxious senile Australian pest:
"I'm willing to bet you scream your own name when jacking off."
MID: <s78tjv$14d$2@dont-email.me>

"Who or What is Rod Speed?

Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
man" on the InterNet."
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/

--
John addressing the senile Australian pest:
"You are a complete idiot. But you make me larf. LOL"
MID: <f9056fe6-1479-40ff-8cc0-8118292c547e@googlegroups.com>

On 2/23/2024 5:14 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
> says...
>>
>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>> AFAIK.
>>
>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>> probably more so.
>>
>>
>
> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
> dads side. I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
> anything left over then help the other countries.
>
> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes when Russia promised not to
> invade and other countries promised to protect them.
>
> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
> that don't.
>
>

I did the ancestory DNA and found it interesting. I knew my father's
parents were from Italy and mother's from Lithuania and DNA confirmed it
but see a scattering around eastern Europe including Russia and around
the Mediterranean.

They also tell you of others that have been tested and you might be
related to. There was a surprise in finding the illegitimate son of a
deceased cousin I never knew and even her brothers did not know existed
until I told them.

Ralph Mowery wrote on 2/23/2024 5:14 PM:
> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
> says...
>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>> AFAIK.
>>
>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>> probably more so.
>>
>>
> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
> dads side. I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
> anything left over then help the other countries.
>
> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes

Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR). They
were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA. Those nukes
were useless to Ukraine anyways because those Russian nukes were
designed, maintained, and controlled by Russians. Those nukes were
deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.

> when Russia promised not to
> invade

Russia had just given back their sovereignty. Why was there a need for
Russia to make that promise? When did Russia promise that?

> and other countries promised to protect them.

If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).

>
> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
> that don't.
>

There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to the east after the USSR
let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go. NATO originally was set up with
the USSR (Russia) as the target enemy. Russia has been warning NATO
about its encroachment after the dissolution of the USSR. Ukraine is the
straw that broke the camel's back. Russia simply had to strike back for
self preservation. The geographical locations of eastern Ukraine,
Crimea, and the Black Sea are too important for Russia to let Ukraine
join NATO.

I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical analysis.
The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point. If you don't remember
Maidan Coup, then Google it, and find out the declaration of separation
of Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk from Ukraine as the aftermath of the
Maidan Coup.

Frank wrote on 2/24/2024 7:45 PM:
> On 2/23/2024 5:14 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
>> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
>> says...
>>>
>>> Perhaps.  I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>>> I guess, on my father's side.  Mostly British isles on the other,
>>> AFAIK.
>>>
>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>> countries.  I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>> probably more so.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
>> dads side.  I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>
>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes when Russia promised not to
>> invade and other countries promised to protect them.
>>
>> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
>> that don't.
>>
>>
>
> I did the ancestory DNA and found it interesting.  I knew my father's
> parents were from Italy and mother's from Lithuania and DNA confirmed
> it but see a scattering around eastern Europe including Russia and
> around the Mediterranean.
>
> They also tell you of others that have been tested and you might be
> related to.  There was a surprise in finding the illegitimate son of a
> deceased cousin I never knew and even her brothers did not know
> existed until I told them.

DNA is a fascinating technology. It has helped track down rapists and
murderers by matching the suspects' DNA with DNA databanks to find their
close relatives as leads to investigate from there.

>
>
>DNA is a fascinating technology. It has helped track down rapists and
>murderers by matching the suspects' DNA with DNA databanks to find their
>close relatives as leads to investigate from there.
>
>

And exonerate the many many wrongfully convicted
if the corrupt justice system decides to allow for it.
John T.

On 2/24/2024 5:24 PM, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ wrote:
> Ralph Mowery wrote on 2/23/2024 5:14 PM:
>> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
>> says...
>>> Perhaps.  I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is.  German,
>>> I guess, on my father's side.  Mostly British isles on the other,
>>> AFAIK.
>>>
>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>> countries.  I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>> probably more so.
>>>
>>>
>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
>> dads side.  I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>
>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes
>
> Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR). They
> were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA. Those nukes
> were useless to Ukraine anyways because those Russian nukes were
> designed, maintained, and controlled by Russians. Those nukes were
> deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.
>
>
>> when Russia promised not to
>> invade
>
> Russia had just given back their sovereignty. Why was there a need for
> Russia to make that promise? When did Russia promise that?
>
>
>> and other countries promised to protect them.
>
> If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).
>
>
>>
>> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
>> that don't.
>>
>
> There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to the east after the USSR
> let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go. NATO originally was set up with
> the USSR (Russia) as the target enemy. Russia has been warning NATO
> about its encroachment after the dissolution of the USSR. Ukraine is the
> straw that broke the camel's back. Russia simply had to strike back for
> self preservation. The geographical locations of eastern Ukraine,
> Crimea, and the Black Sea are too important for Russia to let Ukraine
> join NATO.
>
> I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical analysis.
> The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point. If you don't remember
> Maidan Coup, then Google it, and find out the declaration of separation
> of Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk from Ukraine as the aftermath of the
> Maidan Coup.

"In exchange, the U.S., the U.K. and Russia would guarantee Ukraine's
security in a 1994 agreement known as the Budapest Memorandum."

https://www.npr.org/2022/02/21/1082124528/ukraine-russia-putin-invasion

Mighty Wannabe ✅ <.> wrote
> Ralph Mowery wrote

>>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>>> AFAIK.
>>>
>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>> probably more so.
>>>
>>>
>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
>> dads side. I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>
>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes

> Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR).

Its much more complicated than that, most
obviously with the nuke power stations.

> They were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA.

Nothing to do with the USA except that the USA
did say that they would defend the Ukraine if it
was attacked and they had a need for the nukes.
The USA welched on that when it came to the crunch.

> Those nukes were useless to Ukraine anywaysbecause those Russian nukes
> were designed,maintained, and controlled by Russians.

A country that can manage to produce by far the
biggest freight aircraft the world has ever seen
is obviously quite capable of modiifying and
maintaining those nuke and they have shown
that they can do that with the nuke power stations.

> Those nukes were deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.

Its much more complicated than that.

>> when Russia promised not to invade

> Russia had just given back their sovereignty.

Russia had no choice about that
given the collapse of the USSR.

> Why was there a need for Russia to make that promise?

Because otherwise the Ukraine would
not have handed over the nukes.

> When did Russia promise that?

5 December 1994
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

>> and other countries promised to protect them.

> If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).

Nope
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

>> As they say if you turn your weapons intoplows you will plow for those
>> that don't.

> There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to theeast after the USSR
> let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go.

Lie. And the USSR had no choice about that.

> NATO originally was set up with theUSSR (Russia) as the target enemy..

Nope.

> Russia has been warning NATO about its encroachmentafter the
> dissolution of the USSR.

Russia didnt get to warn anyone about anything.

> Ukraine is the straw that broke the camel's back.

Utterly mangled all over again.

> Russia simply had to strike back for self preservation.

Even sillier than you usually manage and that's saying something.

Pity about Georgia and Chechnya

> The geographical locations of eastern Ukraine, Crimea, and the Black Sea
> are too importantfor Russia to let Ukraine join NATO.

> I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical analysis..

An ignorant one that ignores Georgia and Chechnya,

> The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point.

Fantasy. And that wasnt about NATO, it was about
the Ukraine joining the EU instead of Russia.

> If you don't remember Maidan Coup, then Google it, and findout the
> declaration of separation of Crimea, Donbas andLuhansk from Ukraine as
> the aftermath of the Maidan Coup.

Nothing to do with NATO.

On Sat, 24 Feb 2024 23:51:45 +0100, Peeler wrote:

> "Who or What is Rod Speed?
>
> Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
> is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
> enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
> man" on the InterNet."
> https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/

This is what Rod Speed is.
https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/5ridvlPuAGU

Bob F wrote on 2/25/2024 12:09 AM:
> On 2/24/2024 5:24 PM, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ wrote:
>> Ralph Mowery wrote on 2/23/2024 5:14 PM:
>>> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
>>> says...
>>>> Perhaps.  I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is.  German,
>>>> I guess, on my father's side.  Mostly British isles on the other,
>>>> AFAIK.
>>>>
>>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>>> countries.  I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>>> probably more so.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
>>> dads side.  I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>>
>>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes
>>
>> Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR). They
>> were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA. Those nukes
>> were useless to Ukraine anyways because those Russian nukes were
>> designed, maintained, and controlled by Russians. Those nukes were
>> deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.
>>
>>
>>> when Russia promised not to
>>> invade
>>
>> Russia had just given back their sovereignty. Why was there a need
>> for Russia to make that promise? When did Russia promise that?
>>
>>
>>> and other countries promised to protect them.
>>
>> If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).
>>
>>
>>>
>>> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for those
>>> that don't.
>>>
>>
>> There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to the east after the
>> USSR let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go. NATO originally was set
>> up with the USSR (Russia) as the target enemy. Russia has been
>> warning NATO about its encroachment after the dissolution of the
>> USSR. Ukraine is the straw that broke the camel's back. Russia simply
>> had to strike back for self preservation. The geographical locations
>> of eastern Ukraine, Crimea, and the Black Sea are too important for
>> Russia to let Ukraine join NATO.
>>
>> I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical
>> analysis. The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point. If you don't
>> remember Maidan Coup, then Google it, and find out the declaration of
>> separation of Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk from Ukraine as the
>> aftermath of the Maidan Coup.
>
> "In exchange, the U.S., the U.K. and Russia would guarantee Ukraine's
> security in a 1994 agreement known as the Budapest Memorandum."
>
> https://www.npr.org/2022/02/21/1082124528/ukraine-russia-putin-invasion
>

Maybe you should read the article from Wikipedia instead, since NPR is
an official propaganda machine of the US government like Voice of
America and Radio Free Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum#History

If the nuclear weapons were not returned to Russia, they would have been
sold in the black market by the corrupt government.

Russia's promise to "guarantee Ukraine's security" apparently would be
null and void when Ukraine is threatening Russia's security by inviting
US military bases and nuclear missiles into Ukraine.

Anyways, the US broke the promise of not expanding NATO an inch to the
east. The US can build military bases and deploy nuclear missiles in
NATO countries. NATO was created with Russia as the target enemy. As I
have mentioned in my previous post, Ukraine is too close to home to
Russia, and everybody in the world knows who actually were behind the
Maidan Coup. Russia would be stupid not to respond.

Ukraine had really screwed the pooch. Ukraine enjoyed discounted fuel
and discounted natural gas from Russia, and was rolling in dough from
natural gas transit fees levied on Russian gas passing through Russian
gas pipelines through Ukraine to Europe.

Ukraine has lost a lot more land than it did in 2014. There is no
prospect of Russia losing this war. The longer the war drags on, the
more land Ukraine will lose. Zelensky doesn't care. He will be airlifted
out of Ukraine when Kiev falls. Zelenskywas merely a TV comedian before
he lied and won the 2019 presidential election by campaigning on making
peace with Russia. He did exactly the opposite after he won.

I read most of the US and UK news websites, along with the Russian 'RT'
website and the Chinese 'Global Times' website. I read news from the
perspective of the Americans, Russians and the Chinese. That's why I am
not as hoodwinked as most Americans are.

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 18:05:39 +1100, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ <.> wrote:

> Bob F wrote on 2/25/2024 12:09 AM:
>> On 2/24/2024 5:24 PM, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ wrote:
>>> Ralph Mowery wrote on 2/23/2024 5:14 PM:
>>>> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
>>>> says...
>>>>> Perhaps. I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is. German,
>>>>> I guess, on my father's side. Mostly British isles on the other,
>>>>> AFAIK.
>>>>>
>>>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>>>> countries. I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>>>> probably more so.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea about my
>>>> dads side. I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>>>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>>>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>>>
>>>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes
>>>
>>> Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR). They
>>> were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA. Those nukes
>>> were useless to Ukraine anyways because those Russian nukes were
>>> designed, maintained, and controlled by Russians. Those nukes were
>>> deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.
>>>
>>>
>>>> when Russia promised not to
>>>> invade
>>>
>>> Russia had just given back their sovereignty. Why was there a need for
>>> Russia to make that promise? When did Russia promise that?
>>>
>>>
>>>> and other countries promised to protect them.
>>>
>>> If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for
>>>> those
>>>> that don't.
>>>>
>>>
>>> There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to the east after the
>>> USSR let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go. NATO originally was set up
>>> with the USSR (Russia) as the target enemy. Russia has been warning
>>> NATO about its encroachment after the dissolution of the USSR. Ukraine
>>> is the straw that broke the camel's back. Russia simply had to strike
>>> back for self preservation. The geographical locations of eastern
>>> Ukraine, Crimea, and the Black Sea are too important for Russia to let
>>> Ukraine join NATO.
>>>
>>> I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical
>>> analysis. The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point. If you don't
>>> remember Maidan Coup, then Google it, and find out the declaration of
>>> separation of Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk from Ukraine as the aftermath
>>> of the Maidan Coup.
>>
>> "In exchange, the U.S., the U.K. and Russia would guarantee Ukraine's
>> security in a 1994 agreement known as the Budapest Memorandum."
>>
>> https://www.npr.org/2022/02/21/1082124528/ukraine-russia-putin-invasion
>>
>
>
> Maybe you should read the article from Wikipedia instead, since NPR is
> an official propaganda machine of the US government like Voice of
> America and Radio Free Europe.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum#History

Which says nothing like what you claim.

> If the nuclear weapons were not returned to Russia, they wouldhave been
> sold in the black market by the corrupt government.

Bullshit. They would have kept the nukes and even Putin
would not have risked invading Crimea or the Ukraine.

> Russia's promise to "guarantee Ukraine's security" apparently would be
> null and void when Ukraine is threatening Russia's security by inviting
> US military bases and nuclear missiles into Ukraine.

Nothing like that happened.

> Anyways, the US broke the promise ofnot expanding NATO an inch to the
> east.

There was never any such promise.

> The US can build military bases and deploynuclear missiles in NATO
> countries.

ONLY if that country agrees to that, and most don't.

> NATO was created with Russia as the target enemy.

Wrong, as always.

> As I have mentioned in my previous post, Ukraine is too close tohome
> to Russia, and everybody in the world knows who actuallywere behind
> the Maidan Coup. Russia would be stupid not to respond.

Pity about Poland which is even closer.

> Ukraine had really screwed the pooch.

More mindless pig ignorant bullshit.

> Ukraine enjoyed discounted fuel and discountednatural gas from Russia,
> and was rolling in doughfrom natural gas transit fees levied on Russian
> gaspassing through Russian gas pipelines throughUkraine to Europe.

And decided that they would rather be in the EU anyway.

> Ukraine has lost a lot more land than it did in 2014.

And we will see if Russia can keep that.

> There is no prospect of Russia losing this war.

There is no prospect of Russia winning the war, just like wih Georgia.

> The longer the war drags on, the more land Ukraine will lose.

Didnt happen like that with Georgia.

> Zelensky doesn't care. He will be airliftedout of Ukraine when Kiev
> falls.

It aint gunna fall, you watch.

> Zelenskywas merely a TV comedian before he lied and won the 2019
> presidential electionby campaigning on making peace with Russia.

He never did anything of the sort.

> He did exactly the opposite after he won.

Lie.

> I read most of the US and UK news websites, along with the Russian 'RT'
> website and the Chinese 'Global Times' website. I read news from the
> perspective of the Americans, Russians and the Chinese.

But don't have a fucking clue about the basics.

> That's why I am not as hoodwinked as most Americans are.

Obvious lie.

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 19:24:12 +1100, ken, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
R Souls addressing the senile Australian cretin's "personalized" idiotic
spelling:
"Learn to spell, imbecile. And while you're about it learn to mind your
own business as well."
MID: <eohtkhl27bo4osjluadg7q8u9196njn1r9@4ax.com>

On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 16:13:33 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
Pomegranate Bastard addressing the trolling senile cretin from Oz:
"Surely you can find an Australian group to pollute rather than posting
your unwanted guff here."
MID: <c1pqvgte5ldlo1rn3fpl7igtg4h8i9mk7p@4ax.com>

Useless troll "Rod Speed" under another name wrote on 2/25/2024 3:24 AM:
> On Sun, 25 Feb 2024 18:05:39 +1100, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ <.> wrote:
>
>> Bob F wrote on 2/25/2024 12:09 AM:
>>> On 2/24/2024 5:24 PM, 😎 Mighty Wannabe ✅ wrote:
>>>> Ralph Mowery wrote on 2/23/2024 5:14 PM:
>>>>> In article <5u8CN.415346$c3Ea.220606@fx10.iad>, hamilton@invalid.com
>>>>> says...
>>>>>> Perhaps.  I don't have a clear idea what my motherland is.  German,
>>>>>> I guess, on my father's side.  Mostly British isles on the other,
>>>>>> AFAIK.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In any event, I don't feel any particular attachment to those
>>>>>> countries.  I'm as worried about Ukraine as I am about Germany,
>>>>>> probably more so.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> I can easily trace my mother back to Germany but have no idea
>>>>> about my
>>>>> dads side.  I could care less about any of the countries as I am an
>>>>> American and want what is best for America first and if there is
>>>>> anything left over then help the other countries.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ukraine was foolish to give up their nukes
>>>>
>>>> Those were Russian nukes (Russia is the successor of the USSR).
>>>> They were transferred to Russia with the blessing of the USA. Those
>>>> nukes were useless to Ukraine anyways because those Russian nukes
>>>> were designed, maintained, and controlled by Russians. Those nukes
>>>> were deployed in Ukraine by the USSR.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> when Russia promised not to
>>>>> invade
>>>>
>>>> Russia had just given back their sovereignty. Why was there a need
>>>> for Russia to make that promise? When did Russia promise that?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> and other countries promised to protect them.
>>>>
>>>> If there was one, it must've been NATO (USA).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> As they say if you turn your weapons into plows you will plow for
>>>>> those
>>>>> that don't.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There US promised not to expand NATO an inch to the east after the
>>>> USSR let the former Soviet Eastern bloc go. NATO originally was set
>>>> up with the USSR (Russia) as the target enemy. Russia has been
>>>> warning NATO about its encroachment after the dissolution of the
>>>> USSR. Ukraine is the straw that broke the camel's back. Russia
>>>> simply had to strike back for self preservation. The geographical
>>>> locations of eastern Ukraine, Crimea, and the Black Sea are too
>>>> important for Russia to let Ukraine join NATO.
>>>>
>>>> I am not a russofile. This is just a cool-headed geopolitical
>>>> analysis. The Maidan Coup of 2014 was the tipping point. If you
>>>> don't remember Maidan Coup, then Google it, and find out the
>>>> declaration of separation of Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk from
>>>> Ukraine as the aftermath of the Maidan Coup.
>>>
>>> "In exchange, the U.S., the U.K. and Russia would guarantee
>>> Ukraine's security in a 1994 agreement known as the Budapest
>>> Memorandum."
>>>
>>> https://www.npr.org/2022/02/21/1082124528/ukraine-russia-putin-invasion
>>>
>>
>>
>> Maybe you should read the article from Wikipedia instead, since NPR
>> is an official propaganda machine of the US government like Voice of
>> America and Radio Free Europe.
>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum#History
>
> ...............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................
>
>

Content of useless troll Rod Speed's bullshit reply under another troll
name "ken" sanctioned, redacted, discarded, and ignored.