Gave up beer, gout, but I could enjoy a couple of cold beers and a
cigarette😁
Is this the place where all the knowledgeable brewers lurk?

--
Pity the fool who followed his GPS over the cliff

On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:

> Gave up beer, gout, but I could enjoy a couple of cold beers and a
> cigarette😁
> Is this the place where all the knowledgeable brewers lurk?

I'd say I'm a lurker, but that implies more regularity than I regularly
show.

But there's a few of us still hanging about. Have you got a batch brewin'?

Lafe

On 4/22/24 11:30 PM, Lafe wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
>
>> Gave up beer, gout, but I could enjoy a couple of cold beers and a
>> cigarette😁
>> Is this the place where all the knowledgeable brewers lurk?
> I'd say I'm a lurker, but that implies more regularity than I regularly
> show.
>
> But there's a few of us still hanging about. Have you got a batch brewin'?
>
> Lafe
I have, in to it 3 days. I decided to start with organic grape juice,
which has plenty of sugar, approx 1 gram of Champagne yeast (yeast was
proofed in a cup of warm well water with 2 teaspoons of sugar).  As I
said I am using a Torpedo Keg 1.5 Gallon. I have experienced vigorous
activity, I have a gauge on the tank and the pressure easily exceeds the
gauges 40 psi range. In fact I have to regularly burp the keg with the
PRV. When I pull on PRV I can tell that I am close to the valves release
point.

My thinking is when the fermentation starts to slow down then I can
assume that most of the sugar has been consumed, it is at this point
that I plan to bottle the juice with an added half teaspoon of sugar and
cap, allow a few days for additional fermentation/carbonation then
refrigerate. Would you say I am on the right direction for a sparkling
beverage?

On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 10:35:55 -0400, Nic wrote:

> On 4/22/24 11:30 PM, Lafe wrote:
>> On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
<snip>
> I have, in to it 3 days. I decided to start with organic grape juice,
> which has plenty of sugar, approx 1 gram of Champagne yeast (yeast was
> proofed in a cup of warm well water with 2 teaspoons of sugar).  As I
> said I am using a Torpedo Keg 1.5 Gallon. I have experienced vigorous
> activity, I have a gauge on the tank and the pressure easily exceeds the
> gauges 40 psi range. In fact I have to regularly burp the keg with the
> PRV. When I pull on PRV I can tell that I am close to the valves release
> point.
>
> My thinking is when the fermentation starts to slow down then I can
> assume that most of the sugar has been consumed, it is at this point
> that I plan to bottle the juice with an added half teaspoon of sugar and
> cap, allow a few days for additional fermentation/carbonation then
> refrigerate. Would you say I am on the right direction for a sparkling
> beverage?

I'm thinking that it'll be a dry wine with hints of rocket fuel, but
probably very palatable! :D

I'd advise caution with bottling it though. Unless you are *very sure*
that the fermentation is *completely finished* I expect you'll end up
over-carbonating or possibly even detonating your bottles. It might be
worth serving it out of your torpedo keg, if possible! Or transferring it
to another one if you want to age it for very long. You won't explode that
one, and you can burp it as needed if you've got too much pressure.

If bottling is your only option, I'd recommend giving it an extra week or
two after you think it's completely finished, and giving the keg a shake-
n-stir every day or so during that week to give the yeast their best
chance of finishing up. Then crash-cooling it in a fridge to get the yeast
to settle before transferring it for bottling. When you transfer it, it
will probably still have quite a bit of co2 in solution, so be cautious
with how much sugar you add.

Best of luck, and I hope it's delicious!

Lafe

On 4/30/24 10:50 PM, Lafe wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 10:35:55 -0400, Nic wrote:
>
>> On 4/22/24 11:30 PM, Lafe wrote:
>>> On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
> <snip>
>> I have, in to it 3 days. I decided to start with organic grape juice,
>> which has plenty of sugar, approx 1 gram of Champagne yeast (yeast was
>> proofed in a cup of warm well water with 2 teaspoons of sugar).  As I
>> said I am using a Torpedo Keg 1.5 Gallon. I have experienced vigorous
>> activity, I have a gauge on the tank and the pressure easily exceeds the
>> gauges 40 psi range. In fact I have to regularly burp the keg with the
>> PRV. When I pull on PRV I can tell that I am close to the valves release
>> point.
>>
>> My thinking is when the fermentation starts to slow down then I can
>> assume that most of the sugar has been consumed, it is at this point
>> that I plan to bottle the juice with an added half teaspoon of sugar and
>> cap, allow a few days for additional fermentation/carbonation then
>> refrigerate. Would you say I am on the right direction for a sparkling
>> beverage?
> I'm thinking that it'll be a dry wine with hints of rocket fuel, but
> probably very palatable! :D
>
> I'd advise caution with bottling it though. Unless you are *very sure*
> that the fermentation is *completely finished* I expect you'll end up
> over-carbonating or possibly even detonating your bottles. It might be
> worth serving it out of your torpedo keg, if possible! Or transferring it
> to another one if you want to age it for very long. You won't explode that
> one, and you can burp it as needed if you've got too much pressure.
>
> If bottling is your only option, I'd recommend giving it an extra week or
> two after you think it's completely finished, and giving the keg a shake-
> n-stir every day or so during that week to give the yeast their best
> chance of finishing up. Then crash-cooling it in a fridge to get the yeast
> to settle before transferring it for bottling. When you transfer it, it
> will probably still have quite a bit of co2 in solution, so be cautious
> with how much sugar you add.
>
> Best of luck, and I hope it's delicious!
>
> Lafe
The batch is completed on 4/26/24. It tasted pretty awful, even with the
1/2 teaspoon of sugar added to each bottle, all the sugar was consumed,
the carbonation pressure was perfect. I think the problem was in the
original juice, even though it was listed as organic grape juice, they
added citric acid for tartness, when all the sugar was gone all that was
left was the citric acid (the tartness). I will attempt another batch in
a week or so, this time I will use a pure vanilla extract, boiled well
water and sugar. Cream soda is another one of life's pleasures.

On Wed, 1 May 2024 14:44:02 -0400, Nic wrote:

> On 4/30/24 10:50 PM, Lafe wrote:
>> On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 10:35:55 -0400, Nic wrote:
>>
>>> On 4/22/24 11:30 PM, Lafe wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
>> <snip>
> The batch is completed on 4/26/24. It tasted pretty awful, even with the
> 1/2 teaspoon of sugar added to each bottle, all the sugar was consumed,
> the carbonation pressure was perfect. I think the problem was in the
> original juice, even though it was listed as organic grape juice, they
> added citric acid for tartness, when all the sugar was gone all that was
> left was the citric acid (the tartness). I will attempt another batch in
> a week or so, this time I will use a pure vanilla extract, boiled well
> water and sugar. Cream soda is another one of life's pleasures.

Sorry to hear that it came out too dry. Using beer yeast instead of
champagne yeast might result in a sweeter flavor, as it doesn't tend to
ferment the sugars out as completely.

Good luck with the cream soda!

Lafe

On 5/2/24 11:18 PM, Lafe wrote:
> On Wed, 1 May 2024 14:44:02 -0400, Nic wrote:
>
>> On 4/30/24 10:50 PM, Lafe wrote:
>>> On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 10:35:55 -0400, Nic wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 4/22/24 11:30 PM, Lafe wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Apr 2024 17:36:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
>>> <snip>
>> The batch is completed on 4/26/24. It tasted pretty awful, even with the
>> 1/2 teaspoon of sugar added to each bottle, all the sugar was consumed,
>> the carbonation pressure was perfect. I think the problem was in the
>> original juice, even though it was listed as organic grape juice, they
>> added citric acid for tartness, when all the sugar was gone all that was
>> left was the citric acid (the tartness). I will attempt another batch in
>> a week or so, this time I will use a pure vanilla extract, boiled well
>> water and sugar. Cream soda is another one of life's pleasures.
> Sorry to hear that it came out too dry. Using beer yeast instead of
> champagne yeast might result in a sweeter flavor, as it doesn't tend to
> ferment the sugars out as completely.
>
> Good luck with the cream soda!
>
> Lafe
I will keep that in mind, that champagne yeast consumes more sugar. I
want to test out the same yeast to see if the results with plain sugar
and vanilla come out the same way. I have looked at yeasts and there is
a whole lot of information going on there, top fermenting, bottom
fermenting..etc. I have some distillers yeast, what do you think the
characteristics of this type of yeast are?

On Fri, 3 May 2024 04:41:41 -0400, Nic wrote:
<snip>
> I will keep that in mind, that champagne yeast consumes more sugar. I
> want to test out the same yeast to see if the results with plain sugar
> and vanilla come out the same way. I have looked at yeasts and there is
> a whole lot of information going on there, top fermenting, bottom
> fermenting..etc. I have some distillers yeast, what do you think the
> characteristics of this type of yeast are?

Distiller's yeast is specialized towards fermenting the maximum amount of
sugars possible; I think more so than even your typical champagne yeast
can handle. Its job is to produce the maximum amount of alcohol possible.
If you want any sweetness left, this is not a good choice... but if you're
looking for highest possible ethanol production, it's the yeast for the
job. If its your yeast for the primary fermentation, I would also expect
the flavor profile that it contributes to be rather poor.

Plain sugar, though, is fermented almost completely by practically any
strain of yeast. It can be used to dry out any recipe, as well as to
reliably increase its alcohol content. If you want residual sweetness
you'll want to use a more complex source of sugars, such as malt extract
(for beer making), otherwise you have to resort to extreme measures to
kill or remove the yeast before adding your sugar for sweetening after the
fact. Or use some alternative form of sweetening agent that your yeasty
buddies can't eat.

I should note that some types of malt extract (or other kinds of
extracts!) can be great for leaving sweetness, but my experience has been
in doing so with beer yeast (Saccharomyces cerevisiae, for ales or
Saccharomyces pastorianus for lagers). I think one feature of distiller's
yeast is its capacity to eat even more complex sugars than its more tame
cousins, so this measure might not add as much sweetness as might be
hoped, unless you get some very caramelized extract.

My experience is mostly focused on beer, so I'm sorry I can't offer better
advice for your cream soda!

Lafe

On 5/3/24 9:54 PM, Lafe wrote:
> On Fri, 3 May 2024 04:41:41 -0400, Nic wrote:
> <snip>
>> I will keep that in mind, that champagne yeast consumes more sugar. I
>> want to test out the same yeast to see if the results with plain sugar
>> and vanilla come out the same way. I have looked at yeasts and there is
>> a whole lot of information going on there, top fermenting, bottom
>> fermenting..etc. I have some distillers yeast, what do you think the
>> characteristics of this type of yeast are?
> Distiller's yeast is specialized towards fermenting the maximum amount of
> sugars possible; I think more so than even your typical champagne yeast
> can handle. Its job is to produce the maximum amount of alcohol possible.
> If you want any sweetness left, this is not a good choice... but if you're
> looking for highest possible ethanol production, it's the yeast for the
> job. If its your yeast for the primary fermentation, I would also expect
> the flavor profile that it contributes to be rather poor.
>
> Plain sugar, though, is fermented almost completely by practically any
> strain of yeast. It can be used to dry out any recipe, as well as to
> reliably increase its alcohol content. If you want residual sweetness
> you'll want to use a more complex source of sugars, such as malt extract
> (for beer making), otherwise you have to resort to extreme measures to
> kill or remove the yeast before adding your sugar for sweetening after the
> fact. Or use some alternative form of sweetening agent that your yeasty
> buddies can't eat.
>
> I should note that some types of malt extract (or other kinds of
> extracts!) can be great for leaving sweetness, but my experience has been
> in doing so with beer yeast (Saccharomyces cerevisiae, for ales or
> Saccharomyces pastorianus for lagers). I think one feature of distiller's
> yeast is its capacity to eat even more complex sugars than its more tame
> cousins, so this measure might not add as much sweetness as might be
> hoped, unless you get some very caramelized extract.
>
> My experience is mostly focused on beer, so I'm sorry I can't offer better
> advice for your cream soda!
>
> Lafe
>
The field getting narrower and narrower to making home made soda pop.
What I dont understand is why champagne yeast is recommended for soda
making. My end goal is to have a probiotic  beverage that can be made at
home and tastes good. Have you any thoughts on the yeast

Saccharomyces boulardii? I discovered this yeast after watching this
video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo4sgh7iyao

I ordered some from Amazon and plan another batch of cream soda using
this yeast to ferment.

On Sat, 4 May 2024 15:08:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
> The field getting narrower and narrower to making home made soda pop.
> What I dont understand is why champagne yeast is recommended for soda
> making.

For making a sweet, carbonated beverage, you probably want to explore
force carbonation. It can be done with small CO2 tanks, minimal fittings
(of which a regulator is the main expense), and 2-liter plastic bottles
quite handily! I used to make carbonated lemon water, or watermelon water
all the time for my family in the summer. Super easy, cheap, and a lovely
*replacement* for soda.

For making *fermented* beverages that are not going to be super dry and
alcoholic, there are plenty of options, but they don't usually taste much
like the soda the we have today.

Small beers, or mild ales, can be lovely alternatives, and some folks have
studied the field quite extensively and come up with very tasty results.

Also maybe look into alternative fermented beverages like kombucha!

> My end goal is to have a probiotic  beverage that can be made at
> home and tastes good. Have you any thoughts on the yeast

In my mind, this describes home-brewed beer! :) But again, it won't
taste much like soda.

> Saccharomyces boulardii? I discovered this yeast after watching this
> video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo4sgh7iyao

That video was very interesting! I have a few thoughts after watching it.

First things first, I have no experience doing what that fellow is doing.
Nor have I ever used that kind of yeast for anything.

He dumped some yeast in fruit juice in a *glass* jar and sealed it up.
That just seems like asking for trouble to me. :D He mentions that if you
let it run too long that it can explode. So I guess if you're gonna use
his method just make /certain/ that you are not going to forget for a
little too long. Or at least be a little smarter and use plastic bottles,
so when you disturb it you're just getting fruit juice on your ceiling,
and not glass shards in your eyes.

It still has some sweetness left just because he drinks it before
fermentation is done.

I can't comment on the health factors of that yeast because I don't know
any of them.

My over-all advice is that if you're going to use his method, please be
cautious!

> I ordered some from Amazon and plan another batch of cream soda using
> this yeast to ferment.

If you're planning to drink it before fermentation is done, please also
note that any time I've drunk anything actively fermenting it continues
happily doing so all the way through my "system", if you know what I
mean. :D

Lafe

On 5/5/24 12:16 AM, Lafe wrote:
> On Sat, 4 May 2024 15:08:16 -0400, Nic wrote:
>> The field getting narrower and narrower to making home made soda pop.
>> What I dont understand is why champagne yeast is recommended for soda
>> making.
> For making a sweet, carbonated beverage, you probably want to explore
> force carbonation. It can be done with small CO2 tanks, minimal fittings
> (of which a regulator is the main expense), and 2-liter plastic bottles
> quite handily! I used to make carbonated lemon water, or watermelon water
> all the time for my family in the summer. Super easy, cheap, and a lovely
> *replacement* for soda.
>
> For making *fermented* beverages that are not going to be super dry and
> alcoholic, there are plenty of options, but they don't usually taste much
> like the soda the we have today.
>
> Small beers, or mild ales, can be lovely alternatives, and some folks have
> studied the field quite extensively and come up with very tasty results.
>
> Also maybe look into alternative fermented beverages like kombucha!
>
>> My end goal is to have a probiotic  beverage that can be made at
>> home and tastes good. Have you any thoughts on the yeast
> In my mind, this describes home-brewed beer! :) But again, it won't
> taste much like soda.
>
>> Saccharomyces boulardii? I discovered this yeast after watching this
>> video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo4sgh7iyao
> That video was very interesting! I have a few thoughts after watching it.
>
> First things first, I have no experience doing what that fellow is doing.
> Nor have I ever used that kind of yeast for anything.
>
> He dumped some yeast in fruit juice in a *glass* jar and sealed it up.
> That just seems like asking for trouble to me. :D He mentions that if you
> let it run too long that it can explode. So I guess if you're gonna use
> his method just make /certain/ that you are not going to forget for a
> little too long. Or at least be a little smarter and use plastic bottles,
> so when you disturb it you're just getting fruit juice on your ceiling,
> and not glass shards in your eyes.
>
> It still has some sweetness left just because he drinks it before
> fermentation is done.
>
> I can't comment on the health factors of that yeast because I don't know
> any of them.
>
> My over-all advice is that if you're going to use his method, please be
> cautious!
>
>> I ordered some from Amazon and plan another batch of cream soda using
>> this yeast to ferment.
> If you're planning to drink it before fermentation is done, please also
> note that any time I've drunk anything actively fermenting it continues
> happily doing so all the way through my "system", if you know what I
> mean. :D
>
> Lafe
I plan to use the corny keg for the fermentation, the keg has a pressure
release valve that will burp the ferment. So maybe the answer is in your
answer, drinking the ferment before it has become very dry.  I have
received the yeast (Saccharomyces boulardii), swallowed a capsule to
test it out on my body, the results were a pleasing sensation in my gut.
Here is my plan, 1 gallon of boiled well water, 2 cups of dissolved
sugar, 4 tablespoons of vanilla bean paste, 1 Saccharomyces boulardii
capsule, then monitor the pressure gauge on the corny keg. It will
probably take some guess work to determine when to bottle the brew to
avoid broken glass bottles. I imagine that by observation of the primary
fermentation in the keg, the degree of aggressiveness the yeast digests
the sugar will be an indicator. Almost seems like voodoo science.