I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
fraud exists.

I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
felony voter fraud charges

https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v

Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
Sheriff’s Office.

According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.

Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.

On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
> was voter fraud.  I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
> fraud exists.
>
> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
> felony voter fraud charges
>
> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>
> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
> Sheriff’s Office.
>
> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>
> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.

I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or event)
go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump has been
indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
--
Snag
Men don't protect women because they're weak .
We protect them because they're important .

On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>> was voter fraud.  I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is
>> proof fraud exists.
>>
>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>> felony voter fraud charges
>>
>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>>
>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
>> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
>> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
>> Sheriff’s Office.
>>
>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
>> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
>> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>>
>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
>
>   I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or event)
> go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump has been
> indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .

Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.

On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
>> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
>>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
>>> there was voter fraud.  I, an others, have doubted it, but now there
>>> is proof fraud exists.
>>>
>>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>>> felony voter fraud charges
>>>
>>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>>>
>>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
>>> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
>>> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
>>> Sheriff’s Office.
>>>
>>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
>>> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
>>> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>>>
>>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
>>
>>    I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
>> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump
>> has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
>
>
> Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.

I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more than
wrong .
--
Snag
Men don't protect women because they're weak .
We protect them because they're important .

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P <esp@snet.xxx> wrote:

>I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
>fraud exists.

It takes a big man to apologize like that. I should do the same.

>I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>felony voter fraud charges
>
>https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>
>Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
>with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
>locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
>Sheriff’s Office.
>
>According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
>and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
>felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>
>Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.

Good to hear that it's being prosecuted. This story actually made it onto my
local TV news.

On 8/30/2023 10:58 PM, Snag wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
>> On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
>>> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
>>>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
>>>> there was voter fraud.  I, an others, have doubted it, but now there
>>>> is proof fraud exists.
>>>>
>>>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>>>> felony voter fraud charges
>>>>
>>>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>>>>
>>>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and
>>>> charged with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or
>>>> unauthorized locations,” according to jail records provided by
>>>> Madison County Sheriff’s Office.
>>>>
>>>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday
>>>> afternoon and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a
>>>> Class C felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in
>>>> prison.
>>>>
>>>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>>>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
>>>
>>>    I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
>>> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that
>>> Trump has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
>>
>>
>> Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
>
>   I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more than
> wrong .

Sure he is. Only owes $1Billion for his lies.

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 22:35:39 -0500, Jim Joyce wrote:

> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P <esp@snet.xxx> wrote:
>
>>I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>>was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
>>fraud exists.
>
> It takes a big man to apologize like that. I should do the same.

Ed should be careful. It really doesn't matter whose hand was in the
cookie jar. If a Republican can manage to cast multiple ballots that is
proof that fraud is possible under the current system.

On 2023-08-31, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 22:35:39 -0500, Jim Joyce wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P <esp@snet.xxx> wrote:
>>
>>>I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>>>was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
>>>fraud exists.
>>
>> It takes a big man to apologize like that. I should do the same.
>
> Ed should be careful. It really doesn't matter whose hand was in the
> cookie jar. If a Republican can manage to cast multiple ballots that is
> proof that fraud is possible under the current system.

Sure, it's possible. Does it happen in quantities large enough to
affect elections? Rarely.

That's why Michigan, at least, audits its elections. I can't
speak for other jurisdictions.

And, yes, election fraud should be investigated and, where it's
found, prosecuted.

--
Cindy Hamilton

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On 2023-08-31, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 22:35:39 -0500, Jim Joyce wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P <esp@snet.xxx> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>>>> was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
>>>> fraud exists.
>>>
>>> It takes a big man to apologize like that. I should do the same.
>>
>> Ed should be careful. It really doesn't matter whose hand was in the
>> cookie jar. If a Republican can manage to cast multiple ballots that is
>> proof that fraud is possible under the current system.
>
> Sure, it's possible. Does it happen in quantities large enough to
> affect elections? Rarely.
>
> That's why Michigan, at least, audits its elections. I can't
> speak for other jurisdictions.
>
> And, yes, election fraud should be investigated and, where it's
> found, prosecuted.
>

Reporting election fraud to Michigan AG Nessle is like reporting a bank robbery to John Dillenger.

From The Gateway Pundit:

EVIDENCE OF TIES TO THE MI DEMOCRATIC PARTY? Newly Obtained Muskegon Police Report Reveals GBI Strategies Was Hired by “Empower Michigan”
Project that Shares Address with MI Dem Party

On August 8, the Gateway Pundit revealed a major fraudulent voter registration operation that had been under investigation for almost 3 years in
Michigan that spanned several cities across the state. Although the investigation involved lead investigators working for Michigan’s Democrat
Attorney General Dana Nessel and at least one analyst working for Democrat Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson, the true depth of the
investigation and the shocking details uncovered by the MI State Police and Muskegon Police Department were hidden from the public. Publications
like The Detroit News downplayed the investigation and wrote an article to debunk a MI STATE POLICE REPORT titled, Michigan probe into
fraudulent voter registrations referred to FBI, suggesting that the Gateway Pundit was a conspiracy site for daring to report on the details
found in the MI State Police report we obtained exclusivley from Phil O’Halloran of MI-District 9 and Director of Election Integrity for the MI GOP.

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/08/bombshell-newly-obtained-muskegon-police-report-reveals-corrupt/

Michigan's axis of evil is Lansing.

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P
<esp@snet.xxx> wrote:

>I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
>was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
>fraud exists.
>
>I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>felony voter fraud charges
>
>https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>
>Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
>with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
>locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
>Sheriff’s Office.
>
>According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
>and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
>felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>
>Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.

Some people think it's too much trouble to vote, and they don't. They
are not good citizens.

This man went to the trouble to vote multiple times. He should be
praised.

--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

On 8/30/2023 10:59 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 10:58 PM, Snag wrote:
>> On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
>>> On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
>>>> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
>>>>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
>>>>> there was voter fraud.  I, an others, have doubted it, but now
>>>>> there is proof fraud exists.
>>>>>
>>>>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama
>>>>> on felony voter fraud charges
>>>>>
>>>>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>>>>>
>>>>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and
>>>>> charged with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or
>>>>> unauthorized locations,” according to jail records provided by
>>>>> Madison County Sheriff’s Office.
>>>>>
>>>>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday
>>>>> afternoon and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a
>>>>> Class C felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years
>>>>> in prison.
>>>>>
>>>>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>>>>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
>>>>
>>>>    I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
>>>> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that
>>>> Trump has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
>>
>>    I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more
>> than wrong .
>
>
> Sure he is.  Only owes $1Billion for his lies.

Quiz : Which LIBERAL black preacher owes over $19,000,000 in unpaid
back taxes ?
And which CONSERVATIVE White country singer had all his property
seized for a lesser amount of back taxes ?
--
Snag
Men don't protect women because they're weak .
We protect them because they're important .

On 8/31/2023 8:12 AM, Snag wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 10:59 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>>>>
>>>> Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
>>>
>>>    I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more
>>> than wrong .
>>
>>
>> Sure he is.  Only owes $1Billion for his lies.
>
>   Quiz : Which LIBERAL black preacher owes over $19,000,000 in unpaid
> back taxes ?
>   And which CONSERVATIVE White country singer had all his property
> seized for a lesser amount of back taxes  ?

Which NY businessman over valued his property by $2 billion.

We can play this game forever

On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 10:58:34 PM UTC-4, Snag wrote:
> On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
> > On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
> >> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
> >>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
> >>> there was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there
> >>> is proof fraud exists.
> >>>
> >>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
> >>> felony voter fraud charges
> >>>
> >>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
> >>>
> >>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
> >>> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
> >>> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
> >>> Sheriff’s Office.
> >>>
> >>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
> >>> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
> >>> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
> >>>
> >>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
> >>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
> >>
> >> I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
> >> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump
> >> has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
> >
> >
> > Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
> I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more than
> wrong .
> --
> Snag
> Men don't protect women because they're weak .
> We protect them because they're important .

Alex Jones? The 911 denier? The guy who has a $1 bil judgment against him for the despicable lies
he told about Sandy Hook, where he claimed the grieving parents that lost children were
lying actors, it didn't really happen and ruined their lives, because people like you believed him?
That Alex Jones? I mean after such an obvious and despicable lie that went on for years,
how could any person with connected brain cells believe him?

Speaking of right wing nuts, how about Rudy Giuliani? He just lost his similar defamation
suit, where he admits now that what he said about those two GA election workers was both
false and defamatory. He ruined their lives too. We're waiting now to see how big that
judgment will be.

Or how about Fox News? $750 mil paid to Dominion to settle their defamation lawsuit.
You know, the one where they were peddling stolen election lies to people like you, putting
nuts on the air, while discussing how crazy and stupid those making the claims were among
themselves.

On Thursday, August 31, 2023 at 6:53:33 AM UTC-4, Slevin wrote:
> Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> > On 2023-08-31, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 22:35:39 -0500, Jim Joyce wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 19:21:16 -0400, Ed P <e...@snet.xxx> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along there
> >>>> was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there is proof
> >>>> fraud exists.
> >>>
> >>> It takes a big man to apologize like that. I should do the same.
> >>
> >> Ed should be careful. It really doesn't matter whose hand was in the
> >> cookie jar. If a Republican can manage to cast multiple ballots that is
> >> proof that fraud is possible under the current system.
> >
> > Sure, it's possible. Does it happen in quantities large enough to
> > affect elections? Rarely.
> >
> > That's why Michigan, at least, audits its elections. I can't
> > speak for other jurisdictions.
> >
> > And, yes, election fraud should be investigated and, where it's
> > found, prosecuted.
> >
> Reporting election fraud to Michigan AG Nessle is like reporting a bank robbery to John Dillenger.
>
> From The Gateway Pundit:
>
> EVIDENCE OF TIES TO THE MI DEMOCRATIC PARTY? Newly Obtained Muskegon Police Report Reveals GBI Strategies Was Hired by “Empower Michigan”
> Project that Shares Address with MI Dem Party
>
> On August 8, the Gateway Pundit revealed a major fraudulent voter registration operation that had been under investigation for almost 3 years in
> Michigan that spanned several cities across the state. Although the investigation involved lead investigators working for Michigan’s Democrat
> Attorney General Dana Nessel and at least one analyst working for Democrat Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson, the true depth of the
> investigation and the shocking details uncovered by the MI State Police and Muskegon Police Department were hidden from the public. Publications
> like The Detroit News downplayed the investigation and wrote an article to debunk a MI STATE POLICE REPORT titled, Michigan probe into
> fraudulent voter registrations referred to FBI, suggesting that the Gateway Pundit was a conspiracy site for daring to report on the details
> found in the MI State Police report we obtained exclusivley from Phil O’Halloran of MI-District 9 and Director of Election Integrity for the MI GOP.
>
> https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/08/bombshell-newly-obtained-muskegon-police-report-reveals-corrupt/
>
> Michigan's axis of evil is Lansing.

As usual missing is key information that changes the whole picture. This was
discovered before the 2020 election, the false registrations were removed, presumably
because MI has some verification process in place. Second, MI officials have stated
that the evidence suggests that this was done by some employees of the firm that was
registering voters, that it was not directed by the firm. Which is understandable if they
are paying workers to get people registered out in the field, some could decide to fake
registrations and sit at home or if they are getting paid by the numbers, it would encourage
falsely generating fake ones. Further, I haven't seen any evidence that there was any plan for
fake voters to actually vote. Unless there is evidence of such a plot, then it looks like the
firm was defrauded too. The FBI took over this investigation. If there is a legitimate
beef, it's why no arrests have been made after two years and what, if anything is ongoing
at the FBI. We do deserve an answer to that.

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:49:58 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
<trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

>On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 10:58:34?PM UTC-4, Snag wrote:
>> On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
>> > On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
>> >> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
>> >>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
>> >>> there was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there
>> >>> is proof fraud exists.
>> >>>
>> >>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
>> >>> felony voter fraud charges
>> >>>
>> >>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
>> >>>
>> >>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
>> >>> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
>> >>> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
>> >>> Sheriff’s Office.
>> >>>
>> >>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
>> >>> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
>> >>> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
>> >>>
>> >>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
>> >>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
>> >>
>> >> I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
>> >> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump
>> >> has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
>> >
>> >
>> > Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
>> I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more than
>> wrong .
>> --
>> Snag
>> Men don't protect women because they're weak .
>> We protect them because they're important .
>
>Alex Jones? The 911 denier? The guy who has a $1 bil judgment against him for the despicable lies
>he told about Sandy Hook, where he claimed the grieving parents that lost children were
>lying actors, it didn't really happen and ruined their lives, because people like you believed him?
>That Alex Jones? I mean after such an obvious and despicable lie that went on for years,
>how could any person with connected brain cells believe him?
>
>Speaking of right wing nuts, how about Rudy Giuliani? He just lost his similar defamation
>suit, where he admits now that what he said about those two GA election workers was both
>false and defamatory.

Not sure who did the interview, a woman, not especially someone from
MSNBC, but I heard it on MSNBC, and the interviewer agreed with you. I
wouldn't be surprised if lots of commentators do. However it's not
correct. Giuliani did not admit that his statements were false or
defamatory. The prosecution alleged that they were and Giuliani chose
not to contest the allegation.

The result is similar to an admission, or the same, in that one
proceeding, but it's not transferrable to other proceedings.

It is roughly the equivalent of pleading nolo contendere to a criminal
charge. Nolo contendere, "I don't wish to contend". The results of
that are similar or the same as a guilty plea in the current proceeding,
but the plea cannot be used as evidence in other proceedings, not even a
civil trial, where guilty pleas and convictions at trial are admissable.
Some of this page, which I have not read, may be analogous and useful
for background. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolo_contendere But
Guiliani's proceeding in question is civil, and I'm sure there are
differences. Apparently he's short of money for lawyers and since they
would likely lose this part of the trial anyhow, he's not contesting
liabilility so as to save on lawyers' fees by going straight to the
damages part of the trial.

Otoh when told as part of the lead-in to the reporter's question that he
admitted making false, defammatory statements about the two women,
Giuiliani was outraged, called it a lie, may have called the reporter a
liar (it was hard to hear because of his yelling), and that was wrong
too. Abstaining from contesting is similar enough to admitting it that
that he would have been more convincing, and not seemed insane (seeming
to be denying what everyone knew, or thought they knew), if he had just
explained the difference. But he's going through a hard time right now
and probably has a short fuse.

It occurs to me, How many others of these defendants are basically
wasting loads of money, with more than one high-priced lawyer dragging
things out** and incurring hundreds of hours of legal fees, when some,
most, or all of them will lose anyway. They could plead guilty, often
to reduced charges, after 2 days of negotiation and only have to pay for
2 days. They could at least negotiate what prison they would be in.
Some are worse than others. Some are farther from family.

**Dragging things out...Not improperly, not to increase their fees, but
on the idea that they will try any legal tactic that might help. Maybe
they'll be lucky and one will.

There are definitely advantages to not trying to negotiate with the
prosecutor oneself, to having an intermediary. But IIUC, unlike with a
movie producer or a prospective employer, you can't have your buddy
negotiate with a prosecutor unless the buddy is a lawyer, but i'm not
sure about that.

> He ruined their lives too. We're waiting now to see how big that
>judgment will be.
>
>Or how about Fox News? $750 mil paid to Dominion to settle their defamation lawsuit.
>You know, the one where they were peddling stolen election lies to people like you, putting
>nuts on the air, while discussing how crazy and stupid those making the claims were among
>themselves.

--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

On Friday, September 1, 2023 at 12:33:13 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
> In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:49:58 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
> <tra...@optonline.net> wrote:
> >On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 10:58:34?PM UTC-4, Snag wrote:
> >> On 8/30/2023 7:46 PM, Ed P wrote:
> >> > On 8/30/2023 8:25 PM, Snag wrote:
> >> >> On 8/30/2023 6:21 PM, Ed P wrote:
> >> >>> I have to apologize to some here that have been saying all along
> >> >>> there was voter fraud. I, an others, have doubted it, but now there
> >> >>> is proof fraud exists.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I found this on NewsBreak: GOP state lawmaker arrested in Alabama on
> >> >>> felony voter fraud charges
> >> >>>
> >> >>> https://share.newsbreak.com/4t6nud9v
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Alabama state Rep. David Cole (R) on Tuesday was arrested and charged
> >> >>> with voter fraud on accusations he voted in “multiple or unauthorized
> >> >>> locations,” according to jail records provided by Madison County
> >> >>> Sheriff’s Office.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> According to the sheriff’s records, Cole was booked Tuesday afternoon
> >> >>> and released on bail amounting to $2,500. The charge is a Class C
> >> >>> felony, meaning conviction could result in up to 10 years in prison.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Al.com, a local news outlet, said Attorney General Steve Marshall’s
> >> >>> office confirmed he was prosecuting the case.
> >> >>
> >> >> I see you have fully subscribed to the "Never let a crisis (or
> >> >> event) go to waste." philosophy . Next you'll be telling us that Trump
> >> >> has been indicted for pulling on Sally's pigtails in 3rd grade .
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Thank you for standing up for the cult. Alex Jones is proud of you.
> >> I'm not a follower ... though I understand he's been right more than
> >> wrong .
> >> --
> >> Snag
> >> Men don't protect women because they're weak .
> >> We protect them because they're important .
> >
> >Alex Jones? The 911 denier? The guy who has a $1 bil judgment against him for the despicable lies
> >he told about Sandy Hook, where he claimed the grieving parents that lost children were
> >lying actors, it didn't really happen and ruined their lives, because people like you believed him?
> >That Alex Jones? I mean after such an obvious and despicable lie that went on for years,
> >how could any person with connected brain cells believe him?
> >
> >Speaking of right wing nuts, how about Rudy Giuliani? He just lost his similar defamation
> >suit, where he admits now that what he said about those two GA election workers was both
> >false and defamatory.
> Not sure who did the interview, a woman, not especially someone from
> MSNBC, but I heard it on MSNBC, and the interviewer agreed with you. I
> wouldn't be surprised if lots of commentators do. However it's not
> correct. Giuliani did not admit that his statements were false or
> defamatory. The prosecution alleged that they were and Giuliani chose
> not to contest the allegation.
>
> The result is similar to an admission, or the same, in that one
> proceeding, but it's not transferrable to other proceedings.
>
> It is roughly the equivalent of pleading nolo contendere to a criminal
> charge. Nolo contendere, "I don't wish to contend". The results of
> that are similar or the same as a guilty plea in the current proceeding,
> but the plea cannot be used as evidence in other proceedings, not even a
> civil trial, where guilty pleas and convictions at trial are admissable.

He didn't just say he would not contest it. Rudy specifically stated in a court
filing that he made the statements about Freeman and Moss that are the subject
of the litigation and that he agrees that the statements were defamatory.
I don't see why that can't be used against him in other proceedings if someone
chooses to do so.

> Some of this page, which I have not read, may be analogous and useful
> for background. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolo_contendere But
> Guiliani's proceeding in question is civil, and I'm sure there are
> differences. Apparently he's short of money for lawyers and since they
> would likely lose this part of the trial anyhow, he's not contesting
> liabilility so as to save on lawyers' fees by going straight to the
> damages part of the trial.
>
> Otoh when told as part of the lead-in to the reporter's question that he
> admitted making false, defammatory statements about the two women,
> Giuiliani was outraged, called it a lie, may have called the reporter a
> liar (it was hard to hear because of his yelling), and that was wrong
> too.

No surprise there. What's surprising is that the Trumpers watch this and just
ignore it. Rudy has never apologized to the two either. And this case is probably
the worst and best documented. This is the infamous boxes of ballots in suitcases,
pulled from under tables. Rudy went on with that lie continuously, he even showed
up at the GA legislature weeks later,, showing security videos of the women, saying
that the Trump people were still trying to figure out where these came from.. First,
they are obviously normal plastic storage containers. And all one had to do to find
out how they got there was what any reasonable, honest person would do
which is to back up the video that Rudy had a couple of hours. That showed that when
counting stopped for the night the workers put the ballots they had been processing
back into the normal plastic containers and then put them under the table. Later
when counting resumed, they retrieved them. He also claimed they were passing
around "USB ports" (shows how knowledgeable Rudy is) like cocaine. I've heard that
was one giving the other one a candy or mint.

Abstaining from contesting is similar enough to admitting it that
> that he would have been more convincing, and not seemed insane (seeming
> to be denying what everyone knew, or thought they knew), if he had just
> explained the difference. But he's going through a hard time right now
> and probably has a short fuse.
>
>
> It occurs to me, How many others of these defendants are basically
> wasting loads of money, with more than one high-priced lawyer dragging
> things out** and incurring hundreds of hours of legal fees, when some,
> most, or all of them will lose anyway. They could plead guilty, often
> to reduced charges, after 2 days of negotiation and only have to pay for
> 2 days. They could at least negotiate what prison they would be in.
> Some are worse than others. Some are farther from family.

It's likely that some of them will cut plea deals for exactly those reasons..
The Mar a Lago documents IT guy previously lied, then switched from a Trump
provided lawyer to one of his own, fessed up and he's a witness now, not charged.
He's the first. The property manager that was charged is a likely candidate to
flip. Smith is having hearings for some of these defendants to put them on record
as being warned that there is a conflict of interest with them sharing lawyers Trump
provided that are also representing other defendants. That way they can't later
appeal on that basis, but it's also a good opportunity for them to realize that the
lawyer they have could not be looking out for their best interests. How Trump
decided to provide PAC money to pay for some people's lawyers, but not others
is a mystery. It's quite stupid and amazing, even for Trump. I see he is doing a $100K
a plate fund raiser for Rudy this month though. Maybe Trump being a cheapskate
can't help himself and doles out the money based on how loyal he things people are.
If he figures they are very loyal, that they won't flip, then he won't help pay. In reality
he should be paying for all of them, they all did it for him.

>
> **Dragging things out...Not improperly, not to increase their fees, but
> on the idea that they will try any legal tactic that might help. Maybe
> they'll be lucky and one will.

Chesebro and Powell want a speedy trial, it's set for Oct 23. That will be the
first test of what's to come. Others may decide to join, looks like that's the date
for any that want to go fast at this point.

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 2 Sep 2023 08:13:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
<trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

>On Friday, September 1, 2023 at 12:33:13=E2=80=AFAM UTC-4, micky wrote:
>> In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:49:58 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
>> <tra...@optonline.net> wrote:
.....
I'm able to delete what Snag wrote and all who answered him by looking
at the > signs. His attribution line had 3 of them and his text and
all the answers to it had 4 or more.

>> >That Alex Jones? I mean after such an obvious and despicable lie that went on for years,
>> >how could any person with connected brain cells believe him?
>>
>> >Speaking of right wing nuts, how about Rudy Giuliani? He just lost his similar defamation
>> >suit, where he admits now that what he said about those two GA election workers was both false and defamatory.

>> Not sure who did the interview, a woman, not especially someone from
>> MSNBC, but I heard it on MSNBC, and the interviewer agreed with you. I
>> wouldn't be surprised if lots of commentators do. However it's not
>> correct. Giuliani did not admit that his statements were false or
>> defamatory. The prosecution alleged that they were and Giuliani chose
>> not to contest the allegation.
>>
>> The result is similar to an admission, or the same, in that one
>> proceeding, but it's not transferrable to other proceedings.
>>
>> It is roughly the equivalent of pleading nolo contendere to a criminal
>> charge. Nolo contendere, "I don't wish to contend". The results of
>> that are similar or the same as a guilty plea in the current proceeding,
>> but the plea cannot be used as evidence in other proceedings, not even a
>> civil trial, where guilty pleas and convictions at trial are admissable.
>
>He didn't just say he would not contest it. Rudy specifically stated in a court
>filing that he made the statements about Freeman and Moss that are the subject
>of the litigation and that he agrees that the statements were defamatory.

I only give this one first because Google extracted it and put it first
"“While Giuliani does not admit to Plaintiffs' allegations, he — for
purposes of this litigation only — does not contest the factual
allegations,” he said in a July 26 filing. Freeman and Moss' lawsuits
highlighted the often gendered and racialized nature of threats against
election workers, who are predominantly women." 3 days ago
I've never heard of 19thnews, good or bad
https://19thnews.org/2023/08/rudy-giuliani-defamation-georgia-election-workers-ruby-freeman-shaye-moss/
Further down it continues "Giuliani had recently conceded in
stipulations to the court that he had made false statements about the
two women, though he said the concessions were intended to move the case
forward and maintained his statements were constitutionally protected. "
So now the question is, What does "conceded" mean?, and the webpage
is good enough to make "recently conceded in stipulations to the court "
into a link, to the NYTimes, which I have heard of.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/26/us/politics/giuliani-georgia-election-workers.html
Headline: "Giuliani Concedes He Made False Statements About Georgia
Election Workers"
"Rudolph W. Giuliani has conceded that while acting as a lawyer for
former President Donald J. Trump, he made false statements by asserting
that two Georgia election workers had mishandled ballots while counting
votes in Atlanta during the 2020 election. The concession by Mr.
Giuliani came in court papers filed on Tuesday night....
In a two-page declaration, Mr. Giuliani acknowledged that he had in
fact made the statements about Ms. Freeman and Ms. Moss that led to the
filing of the suit** and that the remarks “carry meaning that is
defamatory per se.”*** He also admitted that his statements were
“actionable” and “false”**** and that he no longer disputed***** the
“factual elements of liability” the election workers had raised in their
suit.

** Well he couldn't deny that.
*** This seems to contradict what I said in the previous post. But I
didn't make it up. I was quoting someone.
**** "He also admitted". I would rather see his own words here.
***** "no longer disputed" This sounds like what I said, but if
elsewhere he admitted it, not disputing it wouldn't undo an admission.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rudy-giuliani-defamation-case-georgia-election-workers-ruby-freeman-wandrea-arshaye-moss/
"[Judge] Howell noted in her opinion that, aside from 193 documents
initially produced by Giuliani, the result of efforts to obtain material
during the discovery process was "largely a single page of
communications, blobs of indecipherable data, a sliver of the financial
documents required to be produced, and a declaration and two
stipulations from Giuliani."

She criticized the two stipulations from Giuliani as holding "more holes
than Swiss cheese," and said they "make clear his goal" of bypassing the
discovery process and a merits trial, where his defenses would be
scrutinized and tested."

Now I would really like to read the stipulation Guiliani made, to see
what he actually admitted. But I'm tired and I'm no longer going to
contest what you said.

>I don't see why that can't be used against him in other proceedings if some
>one chooses to do so.

Either, if I were right, because he didn't say that he did those things,
he only abstained for contesting the allegation that he did.

OR if as it appears I was wrong (too tired to keep checking), because
he said in the very statement where he admitted it that he was only
doing so for that proceeding. As illogical as that is (considering that
if the statement were false, the court is not supposed to accept it, and
if it's true it's true everywhere. Wouldn't DesCarte agree?) the legal
system allows such things in order to move things along. Just as with
nolo contendere. If they didn't allow someone in his shoes to make an
admission in one case that didn't apply in other cases, they wouldn't
resolve the first case and it wouldn't help the other cases anyhow.

On a separate topic, the NYTimes article continues:
"He also refused to acknowledge that his statements had caused the women
any damage — a key element required to collect a judgment in a
defamation case."

Even this, which comes from the NYTimes Alan Feuer (probably?) isn't
quite true. If the defamation is that someone violated the law (any
law????, I don't remember and it probably varies by state. a
misdemeanour? A parking violation, I'm not sure that's not included),
you don't have to show damages to be awarded damages. So calling it
"required" is an overstatement, and thus, false** But showing bigger,
real damages will probably get you, be required to get you, a bigger
judgment than not showing any real damages.

** (Unles perchance it's true in Georgia) It's been 50 years since my
sojourn in law school (and things may have changed). It wasnt' a famous
law school but the percent who passed the NY bar on their first try was
actually higher than Columbia U***. and that was, I'm almost sure,
because the school I went to spent more time than Columbia with cases
and statutes from NYState, so I doubt it but maybe there is some state
where falsely alleging a serious crime won't get even a penny's worth of
judgment if you can't show real damages. A lot of American law comes
from England so it's the same in all the states (except Louisiana). Of
course I don't know British law either.

*** And everyone including those from Columbia takes a bar review course
in advance of the exam, because no law school curriculum covers any
state's law details sufficiently to pass.

Now it's probably on the web now but 50 years ago the bar results came
out in the NYTimes on a known date about 2AM, and young lawyers are
waiting at news stands throughout the city to get a copy of the first
edition.

--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 2 Sep 2023 08:13:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
<trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

>
>No surprise there. What's surprising is that the Trumpers watch this and j=
>ust
>ignore it. Rudy has never apologized to the two either. And this case is =
>probably
>the worst and best documented. This is the infamous boxes of ballots in su=
>itcases,=20
>pulled from under tables.

The person in charge of vote counting did make a mistake by stopping and
letting watchers go home and then restarting, but it had probably been
50 years since a watcher ever had anything bad to say and they just
didnt' think about what they might say now.

But G. said it was obvious or unmistakeable that they were stealing
votes. OBVIOUS? No it's not. Evem if you don't know where the
ballots came from, it's not at all obvious that they're stealing votes.

> Rudy went on with that lie continuously, he even=
> showed
>up at the GA legislature weeks later,, showing security videos of the women=
>, saying
>that the Trump people were still trying to figure out where these came from=
>. First,
>they are obviously normal plastic storage containers. And all one had to d=
>o to find
>out how they got there was what any reasonable, honest person would do
>which is to back up the video that Rudy had a couple of hours. That showed=
> that when
>counting stopped for the night the workers put the ballots they had been pr=
>ocessing
>back into the normal plastic containers and then put them under the table. =
> Later
>when counting resumed, they retrieved them. He also claimed they were pass=
>ing
>around "USB ports" (shows how knowledgeable Rudy is) like cocaine.

That's where the racism is clear. USB "ports" could have been compared
to chewing gum or Kleenex. but they are black so he thinks about
cocaine.

I've he=
>ard that
>was one giving the other one a candy or mint.

It was a ginger mint. I hadn't heard of them but there are several
brands. I think even though she's a grown woman she still looks to her
monther for candy. Charming.

--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 2 Sep 2023 08:13:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
<trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

>
>
>He didn't just say he would not contest it. Rudy specifically stated in a =
>court
>filing that he made the statements about Freeman and Moss that are the subj=
>ect
>of the litigation and that he agrees that the statements were defamatory.=
>=20

Without much more effort, I found the stipulation (in a link from CBS
News)
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.238720/gov.uscourts.dcd.238720.84.2.pdf
I can't copy from it, but it's short. In point 1 he concedes that he
made the statements that Plaintiff's Complaint says he made, and he does
not dispute that the statements "carry meaning that is defamatory per
se".

Nowhere does he say he asserts, says, or agrees the statements were
defamatory. And not disputing is a medium or far cry from saying.

So I and whomever I was quoting were right and IMO the NYTimes and lots
of other sources were misleading. Wow. This is why quoting is better
than paraphrasing. Of course someone made it not possible to ctrl-C
copy the stipulation. But whoever saw it can still read and retype,
quoting what it says instead of paraphrasing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/26/us/politics/giuliani-georgia-election-workers.html
This statement from the NYT seems false "He also admitted that his
statements were “actionable” and “false” and that he no longer disputed
the “factual elements of liability” the election workers had raised in
their suit" None of the words in quotes were in the stipulation, and
the article doesn't say where he admitted them, these don't sound like
words he would have spoken. and while he gets angry and says hostile
things, unlike trump I don't think he makes admissions when he's angry.

>I don't see why that can't be used against him in other proceedings if some=
>one chooses to do so.

Because he has said they can't. Over and over again, 5 times, once at
the start and at the start of each of the 4 points it says that the
stipulation is solely for the purposes of this litigation, before this
court and on appeal.

--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

micky wrote:
> The person in charge of vote counting did make a mistake by stopping and
> letting watchers go home and then restarting, but it had probably been
> 50 years since a watcher ever had anything bad to say and they just
> didnt' think about what they might say now.

WSJ Poll: Trump's Primary Lead Just Doubled, Spelling Trouble for Primary Opponents and Biden

https://redstate.com/jeffc/2023/09/02/trumps-primary-lead-just-doubled-spelling-trouble-for-primary-opponents-and-biden-n2163364

The cheatocrats will have to crank up the turbo cheat mode on the tabulators.

On Saturday, September 2, 2023 at 1:47:36 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:

> Even this, which comes from the NYTimes Alan Feuer (probably?) isn't
> quite true. If the defamation is that someone violated the law (any
> law????, I don't remember and it probably varies by state. a
> misdemeanour? A parking violation, I'm not sure that's not included),
> you don't have to show damages to be awarded damages. So calling it
> "required" is an overstatement, and thus, false** But showing bigger,
> real damages will probably get you, be required to get you, a bigger
> judgment than not showing any real damages.

Rudy will find out soon enough. The next phase is a trial to determine the
damages. From what I've seen reported, it's bad. There were death threats,
people showing up at their homes, FBI had to remove them from their homes
on Jan 6. I'm sure those two women will have quite a story to tell.
And this went on for a long time, it was known that they were being harrassed
and threatened, Rudy could have come out and
said that he got it wrong, that people should leave them alone. Even to this
day, other than the court filing, he hasn't said anything to the crazy Trumpers
and most of them won't look at what he filed. Appears Rudy knows he has
no defense on the facts, so he wants to move on to some appeal based on
freedom of speech and/or appeal of the amount. He;s raised the freedom of
speech issue many times, how he figures that's a defense against defamation,
IDK. Would seem to me also that if you were going to use that as a defense,
you would have to do it at the initial trial, not try to bring it up on appeal. But
doesn't matter, I can't imagine that would ever work. So, I would expect a
judgment for at least in the hundreds of thousands, maybe north of $1 mil,
depending on how the laws work down there. He also has to pay their legal
fees that I think were about $90K.

The sad thing though is that none of this makes any difference to the stolen
election Trumpers. Not this, not the settlement One America reached with
Freeman and Moss, not the $750 mil paid by Fox News, where it came out that
while putting nuts on the air with stolen election BS, in private they were talking
about how nuts they were. I predicted these suits and losses would be coming,
that they would establish the truth. But the problem is the cult doesn't care about
the truth, just like they rejected the election results, rejected over 60 court decisions,
they reject the truths of the defamation cases. There are more and more Republicans
like Pence and DeSantis acknowledging that the election was not stolen, but so
far that hasn't seemed to have any impact on the cult. If anything, it's more likely
going to finish off those two. And then there is Ramaswamy. He's got some things
in common with George Santos, he will say anything that he thinks helps him at the
moment. He wrote a book that came out less than a year ago where he condemns
Jan 6, says how terrible it was, blames Trump, yet today he minimizes it, says he
will pardon them and wants the other candidates to go on record to do the same.

R may not be around long. Some Republicans are attacking him for getting a law
school scholarship that was funded by George Soro's brother. They are trying to tie
him to Soros using that. I think they have the wrong angle. R is telling the poor
immigrant, rags to riches story, claiming his parents came here with nothing. In
fact, they were upper class in India, his father had a graduate degree in engineering,
quickly got a job a Raytheon, became a patent attorney. His mother had a medical
license as a psychiatrist 6 months after arrival, R went to private school. But back
to the scholarship, I read that in the year he received that scholarship, he had income
of $2.2 mil and that he had earned $2 mil cumulative over the prior three years.
So, big question here, how did he get that scholarship? Any bets he lied with the
poor immigrant story? There are some scholarships based just on merit, but those
are rare. That's what his opponents should be looking into.

On Saturday, September 2, 2023 at 1:57:11 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
> In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 2 Sep 2023 08:13:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
> <tra...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> >
> >No surprise there. What's surprising is that the Trumpers watch this and j=
> >ust
> >ignore it. Rudy has never apologized to the two either. And this case is =
> >probably
> >the worst and best documented. This is the infamous boxes of ballots in su=
> >itcases,=20
> >pulled from under tables.
>
> The person in charge of vote counting did make a mistake by stopping and
> letting watchers go home and then restarting, but it had probably been
> 50 years since a watcher ever had anything bad to say and they just
> didnt' think about what they might say now.

I've heard varying accounts of exactly how that happened. One version was that
some workers who's shifts were up were leaving, others saw that and thought it
was time for all to leave, so they left too.

>
> But G. said it was obvious or unmistakeable that they were stealing
> votes. OBVIOUS? No it's not. Evem if you don't know where the
> ballots came from, it's not at all obvious that they're stealing votes.

I agree. When I first heard of this, I started to look into it and seeing workers
pulling plastic containers of ballots out from under a table sue looks suspicious.
Why they would ever put them there to begin with when they stopped counting,
instead of just leaving them on top of the tables, IDK. Maybe the room wasn't
secure and they figured if anyone came in they would be less likely to be seen
there. But one thing was very clear, they were not suitcases, so they were already
lying about that.

And then to find out where they came from, all one had to do was back up the
video tape that Rudy had a couple of hours to when counting stopped. There
was no mystery. But weeks later Rudy went before the GA legislative committee,
showed the video of the boxes being taken from under the table. He also showed
a portion of video from 6AM and claimed that some woman in that video might
be responsible and he said that they were still trying to determine how the boxes
got under the table. He had the video, it had been days or weeks, he can excerpt
the last part and 6AM, but hasn't just backed up the tape two hours to the point
where they were placed there? That's what any honest person seeking the truth
would have done and it's virtually impossible that Rudy didn't know the truth.
That's one of the charges in the criminal case, that he lied to state officials
and from all that I've seen, it's a slam dunk. Once you pull something this bad,
you have no more credibility about anything.

>
> > Rudy went on with that lie continuously, he even=
> > showed
> >up at the GA legislature weeks later,, showing security videos of the women=
> >, saying
> >that the Trump people were still trying to figure out where these came from=
> >. First,
> >they are obviously normal plastic storage containers. And all one had to d> >o to find
> >out how they got there was what any reasonable, honest person would do
> >which is to back up the video that Rudy had a couple of hours. That showed=
> > that when
> >counting stopped for the night the workers put the ballots they had been pr=
> >ocessing
> >back into the normal plastic containers and then put them under the table. =
> > Later
> >when counting resumed, they retrieved them. He also claimed they were pass> >ing
> >around "USB ports" (shows how knowledgeable Rudy is) like cocaine.
> That's where the racism is clear. USB "ports" could have been compared
> to chewing gum or Kleenex. but they are black so he thinks about
> cocaine.

That connection occurred to me too.

>
> I've he> >ard that
> >was one giving the other one a candy or mint.
> It was a ginger mint. I hadn't heard of them but there are several
> brands. I think even though she's a grown woman she still looks to her
> monther for candy. Charming.
> --
>
> Stumpy Strumpet
> the bimbus
> for dogcatcher

On Saturday, September 2, 2023 at 2:53:30 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
> In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 2 Sep 2023 08:13:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
> <tra...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >He didn't just say he would not contest it. Rudy specifically stated in a =
> >court
> >filing that he made the statements about Freeman and Moss that are the subj=
> >ect
> >of the litigation and that he agrees that the statements were defamatory..=
> >=20
>
> Without much more effort, I found the stipulation (in a link from CBS
> News)
> https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.238720/gov.uscourts.dcd.238720.84.2.pdf
> I can't copy from it, but it's short. In point 1 he concedes that he
> made the statements that Plaintiff's Complaint says he made, and he does
> not dispute that the statements "carry meaning that is defamatory per
> se".
>
> Nowhere does he say he asserts, says, or agrees the statements were
> defamatory. And not disputing is a medium or far cry from saying.

Sounds to me like he sure did agree it's defamatory, right there. He admitted making
the statements and they carry meaning that is defamatory per se.

Per se means “intrinsically,” “in essence,” or “by its very nature.” It comes from Latin, in which it literally means “by itself.”

I don't dispute the statements and I don't dispute that the statements carry
meaning that is defamatory by it's very nature

or

I don't dispute the statements and I don't dispute that the statements carry
meaning that is intrinsically defamatory.

or

I don't dispute the statements and I don't dispute that the statements carry
meaning that is in essence defamatory.

or

I don't dispute the statements and I don't dispute that the statements carry
meaning that is by itself defamatory.

IDK what more is needed.

trader_4 wrote:
> But one thing was very clear, they were not suitcases, so they were already
> lying about that.

“It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘suitcase’ is. If the—if he—if ‘is’ means is and never has been, that is not—that is one thing. If it means there is none, that was a completely true statement. …

Anyway, airlines tend to call them carry-on bags and checked luggage. Some people call them go bags.

Synonyms for suitcase:
case
grip
valise
portmanteau
vanity case
briefcase
attaché case
Gladstone bag
trunk
chest
luggage
baggage
holdall

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 5:17:26 PM UTC-4, Greta Thongturd wrote:
> trader_4 wrote:
> > But one thing was very clear, they were not suitcases, so they were already
> > lying about that.
> “It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘suitcase’ is. If the—if he—if ‘is’ means is and never has been, that is not—that is one thing. If it means there is none, that was a completely true statement. …
>
> Anyway, airlines tend to call them carry-on bags and checked luggage. Some people call them go bags.
>
> Synonyms for suitcase:
> case
> grip
> valise
> portmanteau
> vanity case
> briefcase
> attaché case
> Gladstone bag
> trunk
> chest
> luggage
> baggage
> holdall

And those plastic storage containers are none of the above. If you walked into Walmart
to buy one and told an employee that you wanted a suitcase, where do you think they would
direct you? Of course Rudy knew perfectly well what they were and being a lying shyster,
he called them suitcases because it sounds sinister, people don't expect suitcases to be
present where votes are counted. If he used the correct term, plastic storage containers
it wouldn't seem unusual. He wanted to fool the gullible Trumpers like you. But it's all
falling apart now, One America paid out a settlement, the court just ruled that Rudy did
defame the two election workers, now a jury will decide the damages and it's likely going
to be huge.