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interests / misc.consumers.frugal-living / Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

SubjectAuthor
* Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Lenona
+* Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Dim Witte
|`* Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Lenona
| +- Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Charley
| `* Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Dim Witte
|  `- Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Lenona
`* Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"Mark Owens
 `- Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"The Real Bev

1
Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
From: lenona...@yahoo.com (Lenona)
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 by: Lenona - Fri, 18 Aug 2023 15:39 UTC

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/killing-the-mother/

First paragraphs:

Carmel Richardson
Aug 18, 2023 12:03 AM

The End of Woman: How Smashing the Patriarchy Has Destroyed Us, by Carrie Gress, Regnery Publishing, 256 pages

Mary Wollstonecraft liked the sound of her own voice. Her eventual husband, William Godwin, would complain of an early meeting that “I…heard her, very frequently when I wished to hear [Thomas] Paine.” Despite her prodigality, however, both in spoken and written word, Wollstonecraft was not particularly lucid, prone to chatter and reason in circles. The ideology which she mothered would follow in her footsteps, forging its path through history with a similar excess of words.
Wollstonecraft’s story is where Carrie Gress begins her new book, The End of Woman (Regnery, August 2023). The book chronicles the history of the feminist movement with the goal of bringing to light its under-discussed flaws. A Catholic mother and author of several books, Gress is best known for her Theology of Home series and online magazine, a Christian response to pop culture lifestyle magazines. Gress is no mere “mommy blogger,” however. A fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center, a Washington, D.C. based think tank, and a scholar at the Catholic University of America, Gress has written a number of books on Christian womanhood, including The Anti-Mary Exposed, which explores the toxic view of femininity which has grasped the western world since the 1960s. Fittingly, Gress begins her new book with a study of another Mary, who, she argues, forged the way for this toxic ideology.

Gress is far from the first to chronicle the history of the women’s rights movement and its harmful elements, but she is among the few who identify those elements all the way back at its inception. Where other post-feminists suggest the movement went wrong during the Second Wave, or express dislike for the feminists’ controversial methods and ties to communism, but approve at least some of the results, Gress is not afraid to say that the problems with feminism were baked in the cake. The only way forward is to reject the philosophy whole cloth, starting with Wollstonecraft.

This is not the conservative orthodoxy some might imagine it to be. Erika Bachiochi, also a fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center, has spent much time and effort to make Wollstonecraft palatable to conservatives through the Wollstonecraft Project at The Abigail Adams Institute, which Bachiochi directs, as well as in her book, “The Rights of Women.” But the virtues Bachiochi finds in Wollstonecraft’s thought are too absent, at least for Gress, in the mother of feminism’s life.

The proof, in other words, is in the pudding. This is a thread which Gress pulls on with each of the major feminist namesakes, from Wollstonecraft to Friedan: the girls led debauched lifestyles, many engaged in witchcraft and the occult, and the later women’s involvement in communist groups makes the purity of their intentions suspect at best. Most troubling of all, however, is something which even a strict survey of the founding texts alone cannot overlook: the fundamental goal of the movement was egalitarianism, and its attendant death of all hierarchies, which Wollstonecraft took issue with as fundamentally male.

Much of this trouble can be traced to an abnormally distressing family life, Gress argues, a common feature for every major female in the movement’s history. Wollstonecraft’s father abused her mother and Wollstonecraft herself twice attempted suicide; her daughter with free-love advocate William Godwin, Mary Shelley, spent most of her youth chasing the licentious Percy Bysshe Shelley around Europe. Elizabeth Cady Stanton’s father openly wished she was a son, while her domineering mother left her with a permanent antagonism toward authority. Betty Friedan had a discontented mother, too, who scolded her for her ugliness and large nose, and to whose presence Friedan attributed her own turn to feminism. These were not happy women, they were not raised by happy women, and they did not produce happy women.

“Lost girls,” as Gress refers to them, make bad role models..

Lost girls are also not nice. As each woman became embittered toward men, she broadcast her bitterness to bring countless other women down with her. Gress describes this as “destructive envy:” “It is a kind of envy, but also a hidden rejection of what it means to be a woman.” Which is another way of saying that the story of feminism is a story about mean girls. Moreover, their energy was not always commensurate with the wrongs done to them. Charles M’Clintock, noticing the time it was taking Elizabeth Cady Stanton to write the Declaration of Sentiments, apparently joked, “Your grievances must be very grievous indeed, if it takes you so long to find them.”

Wollstonecraft once wrote that “the more equality there is established among men, the more virtue and happiness will reign in society.” But what has come of egalitarianism, Gress argues, is quite the opposite. The girls who rage against the patriarchy—out of their own hurt, or due to a sense of sisterhood with other, angrier women—“have become exactly the type of man they love to hate: “negligent, narcissistic, aloof, unengaged…like players and cads.”

“We haven’t used our power properly,” Gress writes. For Gress, the problem baked in the feminist cake is that it asked the wrong question: How can women become men? Its conclusions, therefore, are wholly unsuited to reality. They have also led to death: death of unborn babies, death of female fertility, death of marriage, death of family, and death of womanhood itself in the face of the new transgender “science.” More to the point, all this death has not even been good for those who wanted it.

Is there a way which leads to life? Gress says yes. It requires restoring what has been destroyed, including, provocatively, “the patriarchy.” While Gress doesn’t flesh this out, it’s clear from her language throughout the book that her vision is neither slavishness for women nor egalitarianism. Instead, she proposes a grammar of womanhood which emphasizes the female creative role in harmony with men: “As uncomfortable as it is to say, we have to consider women as mothers—even if, of course, many among us aren’t mothers now or won’t become mothers,” she writes. This is because “all women are called to a type of psychological or spiritual motherhood in our relationship with others, where we look out for the best interest of others, mentor them, and help them grow.”

This grammar of motherhood involves women seeking to serve others, to take responsibility for our actions and behavior, to restore the art of homemaking, and to nourish and hold those in our care. We might describe this vision for women as replacing Mary, the mother of feminism, with Mary, the mother of Jesus. She’s a sight for sore eyes.
About The Author

Carmel Richardson is a contributing editor at The American Conservative. She received her B.A. from Hillsdale College in political philosophy with a minor in journalism, and is a native of the greatest state in the union, Tennessee.

_________________________________________________

Groan.

Reading between the lines, I see, among other things, a push to return to the days when women were expected to do unpaid work (outside the home, that is) - and men WEREN'T. Why should a woman have less leisure time than a man? Even a woman who enjoys doing her own housework doesn't necessarily want to cook and clean for other people. (Nor should she have to do all her OWN housework even if she's a SAHM. After all, anyone with a baby or toddler likely doesn't get much sleep, unlike anyone who only works 40 hours a week.)

Not to mention that the trouble with expecting women facing unplanned pregnancies to have the babies, raise them and "learn to love" them is that the love very often never happens. Especially on the father's side. That does the children no good.

As Katha Pollitt pointed out, a woman has 30 years of fertility, so of COURSE half of all pregnancies are unplanned. (If any lesson should be #1 in comprehensive sex ed, I'd say it should be that even a couple that uses the Pill or the IUD, MUST use an extra artificial contraceptive - Every Time.)

And, of course, the "death of female fertility" likely includes women's REFUSAL to have as many children as the economy demands. If women WANT more children, but can't afford them, who can blame them for using birth control or even refusing to have sex? Sometimes pursuing the almighty dollar just isn't worth it, for multiple reasons - one being that a couple might not have any time to spend with the child that the couple can only AFFORD by pursuing the almighty dollar.

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
From: dakadl...@gmail.com (Dim Witte)
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 by: Dim Witte - Sat, 19 Aug 2023 02:12 UTC

On Friday, August 18, 2023 at 7:39:21 AM UTC-8, Lenona wrote:
> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/killing-the-mother/
>
> First paragraphs:
>
> Carmel Richardson
> Aug 18, 2023 12:03 AM
>
> The End of Woman: How Smashing the Patriarchy Has Destroyed Us, by Carrie Gress, Regnery Publishing, 256 pages
>
> Mary Wollstonecraft liked the sound of her own voice. Her eventual husband, William Godwin, would complain of an early meeting that “I…heard her, very frequently when I wished to hear [Thomas] Paine.” Despite her prodigality, however, both in spoken and written word, Wollstonecraft was not particularly lucid, prone to chatter and reason in circles. The ideology which she mothered would follow in her footsteps, forging its path through history with a similar excess of words.
>
> Wollstonecraft’s story is where Carrie Gress begins her new book, The End of Woman (Regnery, August 2023). The book chronicles the history of the feminist movement with the goal of bringing to light its under-discussed flaws. A Catholic mother and author of several books, Gress is best known for her Theology of Home series and online magazine, a Christian response to pop culture lifestyle magazines. Gress is no mere “mommy blogger,” however. A fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center, a Washington, D.C. based think tank, and a scholar at the Catholic University of America, Gress has written a number of books on Christian womanhood, including The Anti-Mary Exposed, which explores the toxic view of femininity which has grasped the western world since the 1960s. Fittingly, Gress begins her new book with a study of another Mary, who, she argues, forged the way for this toxic ideology.
>
> Gress is far from the first to chronicle the history of the women’s rights movement and its harmful elements, but she is among the few who identify those elements all the way back at its inception. Where other post-feminists suggest the movement went wrong during the Second Wave, or express dislike for the feminists’ controversial methods and ties to communism, but approve at least some of the results, Gress is not afraid to say that the problems with feminism were baked in the cake. The only way forward is to reject the philosophy whole cloth, starting with Wollstonecraft.
>
> This is not the conservative orthodoxy some might imagine it to be. Erika Bachiochi, also a fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center, has spent much time and effort to make Wollstonecraft palatable to conservatives through the Wollstonecraft Project at The Abigail Adams Institute, which Bachiochi directs, as well as in her book, “The Rights of Women.” But the virtues Bachiochi finds in Wollstonecraft’s thought are too absent, at least for Gress, in the mother of feminism’s life.
>
> The proof, in other words, is in the pudding. This is a thread which Gress pulls on with each of the major feminist namesakes, from Wollstonecraft to Friedan: the girls led debauched lifestyles, many engaged in witchcraft and the occult, and the later women’s involvement in communist groups makes the purity of their intentions suspect at best. Most troubling of all, however, is something which even a strict survey of the founding texts alone cannot overlook: the fundamental goal of the movement was egalitarianism, and its attendant death of all hierarchies, which Wollstonecraft took issue with as fundamentally male.
>
> Much of this trouble can be traced to an abnormally distressing family life, Gress argues, a common feature for every major female in the movement’s history. Wollstonecraft’s father abused her mother and Wollstonecraft herself twice attempted suicide; her daughter with free-love advocate William Godwin, Mary Shelley, spent most of her youth chasing the licentious Percy Bysshe Shelley around Europe. Elizabeth Cady Stanton’s father openly wished she was a son, while her domineering mother left her with a permanent antagonism toward authority. Betty Friedan had a discontented mother, too, who scolded her for her ugliness and large nose, and to whose presence Friedan attributed her own turn to feminism. These were not happy women, they were not raised by happy women, and they did not produce happy women.
>
> “Lost girls,” as Gress refers to them, make bad role models.
>
> Lost girls are also not nice. As each woman became embittered toward men, she broadcast her bitterness to bring countless other women down with her. Gress describes this as “destructive envy:” “It is a kind of envy, but also a hidden rejection of what it means to be a woman..” Which is another way of saying that the story of feminism is a story about mean girls. Moreover, their energy was not always commensurate with the wrongs done to them. Charles M’Clintock, noticing the time it was taking Elizabeth Cady Stanton to write the Declaration of Sentiments, apparently joked, “Your grievances must be very grievous indeed, if it takes you so long to find them.”
>
> Wollstonecraft once wrote that “the more equality there is established among men, the more virtue and happiness will reign in society.” But what has come of egalitarianism, Gress argues, is quite the opposite. The girls who rage against the patriarchy—out of their own hurt, or due to a sense of sisterhood with other, angrier women—“have become exactly the type of man they love to hate: “negligent, narcissistic, aloof, unengaged…like players and cads.”
>
> “We haven’t used our power properly,” Gress writes. For Gress, the problem baked in the feminist cake is that it asked the wrong question: How can women become men? Its conclusions, therefore, are wholly unsuited to reality. They have also led to death: death of unborn babies, death of female fertility, death of marriage, death of family, and death of womanhood itself in the face of the new transgender “science.” More to the point, all this death has not even been good for those who wanted it.
>
> Is there a way which leads to life? Gress says yes. It requires restoring what has been destroyed, including, provocatively, “the patriarchy..” While Gress doesn’t flesh this out, it’s clear from her language throughout the book that her vision is neither slavishness for women nor egalitarianism. Instead, she proposes a grammar of womanhood which emphasizes the female creative role in harmony with men: “As uncomfortable as it is to say, we have to consider women as mothers—even if, of course, many among us aren’t mothers now or won’t become mothers,” she writes. This is because “all women are called to a type of psychological or spiritual motherhood in our relationship with others, where we look out for the best interest of others, mentor them, and help them grow.”
>
> This grammar of motherhood involves women seeking to serve others, to take responsibility for our actions and behavior, to restore the art of homemaking, and to nourish and hold those in our care. We might describe this vision for women as replacing Mary, the mother of feminism, with Mary, the mother of Jesus. She’s a sight for sore eyes.
>
> About The Author
>
>
> Carmel Richardson is a contributing editor at The American Conservative. She received her B.A. from Hillsdale College in political philosophy with a minor in journalism, and is a native of the greatest state in the union, Tennessee.
>
> _________________________________________________
>
> Groan.
>
> Reading between the lines, I see, among other things, a push to return to the days when women were expected to do unpaid work (outside the home, that is) - and men WEREN'T. Why should a woman have less leisure time than a man? Even a woman who enjoys doing her own housework doesn't necessarily want to cook and clean for other people. (Nor should she have to do all her OWN housework even if she's a SAHM. After all, anyone with a baby or toddler likely doesn't get much sleep, unlike anyone who only works 40 hours a week..)
>
> Not to mention that the trouble with expecting women facing unplanned pregnancies to have the babies, raise them and "learn to love" them is that the love very often never happens. Especially on the father's side. That does the children no good.
>
> As Katha Pollitt pointed out, a woman has 30 years of fertility, so of COURSE half of all pregnancies are unplanned. (If any lesson should be #1 in comprehensive sex ed, I'd say it should be that even a couple that uses the Pill or the IUD, MUST use an extra artificial contraceptive - Every Time.)
>
> And, of course, the "death of female fertility" likely includes women's REFUSAL to have as many children as the economy demands. If women WANT more children, but can't afford them, who can blame them for using birth control or even refusing to have sex? Sometimes pursuing the almighty dollar just isn't worth it, for multiple reasons - one being that a couple might not have any time to spend with the child that the couple can only AFFORD by pursuing the almighty dollar.

Communism.

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
From: lenona...@yahoo.com (Lenona)
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 by: Lenona - Sat, 19 Aug 2023 15:47 UTC

On Friday, August 18, 2023 at 10:12:59 PM UTC-4, Dim Witte wrote:
> Communism.

Um, that's not a complete sentence. Explain, please?

I'm sure you don't want anyone to misunderstand you.

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
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 by: Char...@NotTheBookstore.Org - Sat, 19 Aug 2023 22:30 UTC

In article <1cb9d860-b196-4fd3-b011-19e045c942d5n@googlegroups.com>
Lenona <lenona321@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> On Friday, August 18, 2023 at 10:12:59?PM UTC-4, Dim Witte wrote:
>
> > Communism.
>
> Um, that's not a complete sentence. Explain, please?
>
> I'm sure you don't want anyone to misunderstand you.

How about - "This isn't a damn book review of the week club" group?

Or did I miss the chapter on frugal living?

Simple enuf?

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
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 by: Mark Owens - Sun, 20 Aug 2023 03:30 UTC

On 8/18/2023 8:39 AM, Lenona wrote:
>
> The End of Woman: How Smashing the Patriarchy Has Destroyed Us
> _________________________________________________
>
> Groan.

Quit your bitching and get back to work, woman. Where's that beer I told
you to bring me?!

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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From: bashley...@gmail.com (The Real Bev)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.frugal-living
Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2023 21:06:38 -0700
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 by: The Real Bev - Sun, 20 Aug 2023 04:06 UTC

On 8/19/23 8:30 PM, Mark Owens wrote:
> On 8/18/2023 8:39 AM, Lenona wrote:
>>
>> The End of Woman: How Smashing the Patriarchy Has Destroyed Us
> > _________________________________________________
> >
> > Groan.
>
> Quit your bitching and get back to work, woman. Where's that beer I told
> you to bring me?!

Right next to the lawn chair you'll be sleeping in tonight.

--
Cheers, Bev
"Americans are looking for more government in their life,
not less." -- Colin Powell, former Good Guy

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
From: dakadl...@gmail.com (Dim Witte)
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 by: Dim Witte - Sun, 20 Aug 2023 08:09 UTC

On Saturday, August 19, 2023 at 7:47:52 AM UTC-8, Lenona wrote:
> On Friday, August 18, 2023 at 10:12:59 PM UTC-4, Dim Witte wrote:
>
> > Communism.
>
> Um, that's not a complete sentence. Explain, please?
>
> I'm sure you don't want anyone to misunderstand you.

I'm being deliberately duplicitous by labeling the post "communism," since 1) communism seems to be a likely solution to the problem, and 2) a "communism" label warns against an intended propaganda agenda, even when being critical.

Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"

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Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Book review of "The End of Woman"
From: lenona...@yahoo.com (Lenona)
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 by: Lenona - Mon, 21 Aug 2023 16:41 UTC

On Sunday, August 20, 2023 at 4:09:17 AM UTC-4, Dim Witte wrote:
> On Saturday, August 19, 2023 at 7:47:52 AM UTC-8, Lenona wrote:
> > On Friday, August 18, 2023 at 10:12:59 PM UTC-4, Dim Witte wrote:
> >
> > > Communism.
> >
> > Um, that's not a complete sentence. Explain, please?
> >
> > I'm sure you don't want anyone to misunderstand you.
> I'm being deliberately duplicitous by labeling the post "communism," since 1) communism seems to be a likely solution to the problem, and 2) a "communism" label warns against an intended propaganda agenda, even when being critical.

Solution to WHICH problem?

Also, the money/frugality factor is in my last paragraph.

If you're accusing me of communism regarding housework, I was suggesting that her PARTNER should be pitching in, so they can get an equal amount of sleep.

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