"Over the past several months, the West’s support of Ukraine has dimmed. Here in America, our government has become aware that a growing number of American citizens are not on board with sending endless amounts of money overseas.

Across the pond, however, the British Prime Minister Rishi Sunak pledged on Friday to provide Ukraine with over $3 billion in military funding this year. This money would fund Ukrainian drones, artillery, missiles, and other weapons necessary to fend off Putin’s Russia.

Additionally, Sunak and Zelensky signed a security agreement that includes:

Provision of comprehensive assistance to Ukraine for the protection and the restoration of its territorial integrity within its internationally recognised borders, including the territorial sea and free economic (maritime) zone, reconstruction of its national economy, and the protection of its citizens;
Prevention and active deterrence of, and counter-measures against, any military escalation and/or a new aggression by the Russian Federation; and
Support for Ukraine’s future integration into Euro-Atlantic institutions, including by supporting Ukraine’s reform plans and interoperability with NATO.

Such a thorough pact has, since last week, cemented the U.K. as one of Ukraine’s most steadfast supporters in the latter’s war against Russia. Notwithstanding the incredible lengths the agreement goes to to provide Ukraine seemingly endless benefits, the $3 billion donation marks the largest sum of annual funds Britain has spent on their favorite Slavs over the past two years of the war. What sparked this decision?"

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/

ltlee1, <news:b7a1f6fb-a3f2-4f05-9255-cebba3d45bban@googlegroups.com>

> Such a thorough pact has, since last week, cemented the U.K. as
> one of Ukraine's most steadfast supporters in the latter's war
> against Russia. Notwithstanding the incredible lengths the
> agreement goes to to provide Ukraine seemingly endless benefits,
> the $3 billion donation marks the largest sum of annual funds
> Britain has spent on their favorite Slavs over the past two years
> of the war. What sparked this decision?"
> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/

The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).

....

In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.

On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25 PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> ltlee1, <news:b7a1f6fb-a3f2-4f05...@googlegroups.com>
> > Such a thorough pact has, since last week, cemented the U.K. as
> > one of Ukraine's most steadfast supporters in the latter's war
> > against Russia. Notwithstanding the incredible lengths the
> > agreement goes to to provide Ukraine seemingly endless benefits,
> > the $3 billion donation marks the largest sum of annual funds
> > Britain has spent on their favorite Slavs over the past two years
> > of the war. What sparked this decision?"
> > https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
>
> ...
>
> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.

Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to UK
hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its much
diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing up its
NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.

I also think “to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
down” has long passed its sold by date.

Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept Russia?

ltlee1, <news:518e52c1-712a-4860-98ea-f20ecd45d71fn@googlegroups.com>
> On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25?PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

>>> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
>>
>> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
>> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
>> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
>>
>> ...
>>
>> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
>> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
>> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.
>
> Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to
> UK hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its
> much diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing
> up its NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.
>
> I also think "to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
> down" has long passed its sold by date.
>
> Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
> extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept
> Russia?

Because of alienness, as there was, historically, little
interaction between Russia and the north-western corner of
Europe, so in their beliefs Russians must be sort of Huns.

On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 4:16:20 PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> ltlee1, <news:518e52c1-712a-4860...@googlegroups.com>
> > On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25?PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
>
> >>> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
> >>
> >> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
> >> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
> >> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
> >>
> >> ...
> >>
> >> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
> >> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
> >> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.
> >
> > Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to
> > UK hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its
> > much diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing
> > up its NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.
> >
> > I also think "to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
> > down" has long passed its sold by date.
> >
> > Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
> > extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept
> > Russia?
> Because of alienness, as there was, historically, little
> interaction between Russia and the north-western corner of
> Europe, so in their beliefs Russians must be sort of Huns.

"The Benelux Union or Benelux is a politico-economic union and formal international
intergovernmental cooperation of three neighbouring states in western Europe: Belgium,
the Netherlands, and Luxembourg. " Wikipedia

Not the north-western corner of Europe. Are you referring to a different Benelux?

On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-8, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 4:16:20 PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> > ltlee1, <news:518e52c1-712a-4860...@googlegroups.com>
> > > On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25?PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> >
> > >>> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
> > >>
> > >> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
> > >> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
> > >> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
> > >>
> > >> ...
> > >>
> > >> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
> > >> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
> > >> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.
> > >
> > > Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to
> > > UK hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its
> > > much diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing
> > > up its NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.
> > >
> > > I also think "to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
> > > down" has long passed its sold by date.
> > >
> > > Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
> > > extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept
> > > Russia?
> > Because of alienness, as there was, historically, little
> > interaction between Russia and the north-western corner of
> > Europe, so in their beliefs Russians must be sort of Huns.
> "The Benelux Union or Benelux is a politico-economic union and formal international
> intergovernmental cooperation of three neighbouring states in western Europe: Belgium,
> the Netherlands, and Luxembourg. " Wikipedia
>
> Not the north-western corner of Europe. Are you referring to a different Benelux?

?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwestern_Europe#:~:text=5%20References-,Geographic%20definitions,Norway%2C%20Sweden%2C%20and%20Iceland.

Geographically, Northwestern Europe is given by some sources as a region which includes Great Britain,[4] Ireland,[4] Belgium,[5] the Netherlands,[5] Luxembourg,[6] Northern France,[5] parts of or all of Germany,[7][6] Denmark,[4] Norway,[6] Sweden,[6] and Iceland.[2][8] In some works, Switzerland, Finland, and Austria are also included as part of Northwestern Europe.[6]

Under the Interreg program, funded by the European Regional Development Fund, "North-West Europe" (NWE) is a region of European Territorial Cooperation that includes Belgium, Ireland, Luxembourg, Switzerland, the Netherlands and parts of France and Germany.[7]

On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 6:05:44 PM UTC, bmoore wrote:
> On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-8, ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 4:16:20 PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> > > ltlee1, <news:518e52c1-712a-4860...@googlegroups.com>
> > > > On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25?PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> > >
> > > >>> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
> > > >>
> > > >> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
> > > >> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
> > > >> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
> > > >>
> > > >> ...
> > > >>
> > > >> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
> > > >> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
> > > >> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.
> > > >
> > > > Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to
> > > > UK hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its
> > > > much diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing
> > > > up its NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.
> > > >
> > > > I also think "to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
> > > > down" has long passed its sold by date.
> > > >
> > > > Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
> > > > extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept
> > > > Russia?
> > > Because of alienness, as there was, historically, little
> > > interaction between Russia and the north-western corner of
> > > Europe, so in their beliefs Russians must be sort of Huns.
> > "The Benelux Union or Benelux is a politico-economic union and formal international
> > intergovernmental cooperation of three neighbouring states in western Europe: Belgium,
> > the Netherlands, and Luxembourg. " Wikipedia
> >
> > Not the north-western corner of Europe. Are you referring to a different Benelux?
> ?
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwestern_Europe#:~:text=5%20References-,Geographic%20definitions,Norway%2C%20Sweden%2C%20and%20Iceland.
>
> Geographically, Northwestern Europe is given by some sources as a region which includes Great Britain,[4] Ireland,[4] Belgium,[5] the Netherlands,[5] Luxembourg,[6] Northern France,[5] parts of or all of Germany,[7][6] Denmark,[4] Norway,[6] Sweden,[6] and Iceland.[2][8] In some works, Switzerland, Finland, and Austria are also included as part of Northwestern Europe.[6]
>
> Under the Interreg program, funded by the European Regional Development Fund, "North-West Europe" (NWE) is a region of European Territorial
Cooperation that includes Belgium, Ireland, Luxembourg, Switzerland, the Netherlands and parts of France and Germany.[7]

1. Northwestern Europe is much larger than Benelux. Of the Northwestern Europe
includes the Northwestern corner of Europe. But Benelux is not that corner.

2. In both WWI and WWII, Russia is more on the side of Benelux than Germany..
To the extent that Benelux has forgiven and accepted Germany, why not Russia?

3. Not used to interaction with Russia in the past does not make much sense as
the reason of hostility toward Russia in the 21st Century.

On Saturday, January 20, 2024 at 7:09:21 AM UTC-8, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 6:05:44 PM UTC, bmoore wrote:
> > On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-8, ltlee1 wrote:
> > > On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 4:16:20 PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> > > > ltlee1, <news:518e52c1-712a-4860...@googlegroups.com>
> > > > > On Thursday, January 18, 2024 at 4:17:25?PM UTC, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >>> https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-u-k-bleeds-green-for-ukraine/
> > > > >>
> > > > >> The UK (establishment) is hawkish on Russia, the Ukraine is just a
> > > > >> tool. It's an old complex, since centuries back. The UK had lost its
> > > > >> empire in a large part due to Russia (and then the USSR).
> > > > >>
> > > > >> ...
> > > > >>
> > > > >> In the political class sense, the most hawkish on Russia are the UK
> > > > >> and Poland, while in the grassroots sense, the most anti-Russian, or
> > > > >> Russophobic, are people in the Benelux region and close to it.
> > > > >
> > > > > Agree on the UK-USSR great power rivalry of last century plays a role to
> > > > > UK hawkish. I also think UK is hawkish because it is keenly aware of its
> > > > > much diminished influence today. Not being a member of the EU, playing
> > > > > up its NATO role is one avenue for it to be influential.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also think "to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans
> > > > > down" has long passed its sold by date.
> > > > >
> > > > > Don't quite understand why Benelux region people are Russophobic. To the
> > > > > extent that they could accept Germany, why can't they similarly accept
> > > > > Russia?
> > > > Because of alienness, as there was, historically, little
> > > > interaction between Russia and the north-western corner of
> > > > Europe, so in their beliefs Russians must be sort of Huns.
> > > "The Benelux Union or Benelux is a politico-economic union and formal international
> > > intergovernmental cooperation of three neighbouring states in western Europe: Belgium,
> > > the Netherlands, and Luxembourg. " Wikipedia
> > >
> > > Not the north-western corner of Europe. Are you referring to a different Benelux?
> > ?
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwestern_Europe#:~:text=5%20References-,Geographic%20definitions,Norway%2C%20Sweden%2C%20and%20Iceland.
> >
> > Geographically, Northwestern Europe is given by some sources as a region which includes Great Britain,[4] Ireland,[4] Belgium,[5] the Netherlands,[5] Luxembourg,[6] Northern France,[5] parts of or all of Germany,[7][6] Denmark,[4] Norway,[6] Sweden,[6] and Iceland.[2][8] In some works, Switzerland, Finland, and Austria are also included as part of Northwestern Europe.[6]
> >
> > Under the Interreg program, funded by the European Regional Development Fund, "North-West Europe" (NWE) is a region of European Territorial
> Cooperation that includes Belgium, Ireland, Luxembourg, Switzerland, the Netherlands and parts of France and Germany.[7]
> 1. Northwestern Europe is much larger than Benelux. Of the Northwestern Europe
> includes the Northwestern corner of Europe. But Benelux is not that corner.

Benelux is commonly considered part of NW Europe. Why make a big deal about this?

> 2. In both WWI and WWII, Russia is more on the side of Benelux than Germany.
> To the extent that Benelux has forgiven and accepted Germany, why not Russia?
>
> 3. Not used to interaction with Russia in the past does not make much sense as
> the reason of hostility toward Russia in the 21st Century.

Putin's Russia is a watered down version of the Soviet Union.