I get the impression from things various people have said that the
phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
from what it means in my (South African) dialect.

Example of my usage:

Me to wife: The printer's not working.
Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
Me to wife: I'm just saying.

Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
it.

"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.

But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.

Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
I'm just saying."

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

On 10/07/22 14:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
> English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>
> Example of my usage:
>
> Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't
> know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>
> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
> on it.
>
> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>
> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
> philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was
> not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>
> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
> that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
> anything, I'm just saying."

This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".

A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

On 10/07/2022 06:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
> from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>
> Example of my usage:
>
> Me to wife: The printer's not working.
> Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
> Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>
> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
> it.

In my household, that means: "Fix it, tech boy. You know the printer
lies in your skill-set. You may not have noticed the malfunction, but I
have."

>
> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.

Or, alternatively. "I noticed it, and have I brought it to your
attention. I expect you to do something about it".

(I appreciate this is the opposite of what you think it means. However,
it seems that personal communication codes are involved here, beyond
just language. I'm just saying. )

>
> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
> saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
> conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>
> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
> context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
> I'm just saying."
>
>

Pass.

PS: For the first time ever, my Firefox (v. 102.0.1) has refused to send
this message to *two* separate newsgroups (AUE, AEU). Progress!

On 7/10/2022 2:52 AM, Peter Moylan wrote:
> Steve Hayes wrote:

>> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
>> English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>>
>> Example of my usage:

>> Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I
>> don't know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.

>> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
>> on it.

>> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.

>> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
>> philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying"
>> was not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.

>> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
>> that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
>> anything, I'm just saying."

> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of
> person who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true". A bit like
> those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up", which
> are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

I think I use it to mean "Please don't read between the lines". I mean
(or purport to mean*) that I intend none of the implications a hearer
might otherwise take from what I say.
_______________________

*It is a phrase that lends itself to ironic use.

CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> writes:
>I think I use it to mean "Please don't read between the lines". I mean
>(or purport to mean*) that I intend none of the implications a hearer
>might otherwise take from what I say.

More literally, it means, "I'm just giving information
here.". Think of someone saying, "The Emperor has no clothes".

Insofar it is a somewhat disguised affirmation of what has
been said as being actually factual. It points out that the
statement is correct. It is a way of saying that one is right.

It refers to the fact that one still has the right to state facts,
even if they are not heard gladly. Insofar the listener has
no right to feel offended, because facts represent the state
of the world and as such cannot offend.

It is also said that it is left to the listener to draw
conclusions from it. That's the meaning of "just":
"I'm /just/ stating the facts, but I am not drawing
conclusions from it - but you are free to draw your
own conclusions." (Similar to what you [CDB] wrote above).

Of course, it is possible that sometimes this phrase is also
used when what was said actually was /not/ correct, or when
it in fact suggests a certain conclusion quite strongly.
Whenever someone is stating a fact, there must be a certain
reason why he is stating this fact now. This reason might be
to encourage certain conclusions. (Insofar it might be used
"ironically".)

On 10/07/2022 12:00 pm, Stefan Ram wrote:
> CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> writes:
>> I think I use it to mean "Please don't read between the lines". I mean
>> (or purport to mean*) that I intend none of the implications a hearer
>> might otherwise take from what I say.
>
> More literally, it means, "I'm just giving information
> here.". Think of someone saying, "The Emperor has no clothes".
>
> Insofar it is a somewhat disguised affirmation of what has
> been said as being actually factual. It points out that the
> statement is correct. It is a way of saying that one is right.
>
> It refers to the fact that one still has the right to state facts,
> even if they are not heard gladly. Insofar the listener has
> no right to feel offended, because facts represent the state
> of the world and as such cannot offend.
>
> It is also said that it is left to the listener to draw
> conclusions from it. That's the meaning of "just":
> "I'm /just/ stating the facts, but I am not drawing
> conclusions from it - but you are free to draw your
> own conclusions." (Similar to what you [CDB] wrote above).
>
> Of course, it is possible that sometimes this phrase is also
> used when what was said actually was /not/ correct, or when
> it in fact suggests a certain conclusion quite strongly.
> Whenever someone is stating a fact, there must be a certain
> reason why he is stating this fact now. This reason might be
> to encourage certain conclusions. (Insofar it might be used
> "ironically".)

What a complicated life you lead!

When /I/ say "I'm just saying", I'm just saying "I'm just saying".

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> writes:
>When /I/ say "I'm just saying", I'm just saying "I'm just saying".

I think you live in the UK, but the question
was about the meaning in /American English/.

PS: What people also sometimes say is:
"I'm not 'saying', I'm 'just saying'!".

On 10 Jul 2022 11:47:16 GMT, ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram)
wrote:

>Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> writes:
>>When /I/ say "I'm just saying", I'm just saying "I'm just saying".
>
> I think you live in the UK, but the question
> was about the meaning in /American English/.
>
> PS: What people also sometimes say is:
> "I'm not 'saying', I'm 'just saying'!".

I've never heard that.

On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:25:02 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

>I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
>from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>
>Example of my usage:
>
>Me to wife: The printer's not working.
>Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
>Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>
>Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
>it.
>
>"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>
>But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
>saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
>conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>
>Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
>context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
>I'm just saying."

To me it means "there's no guarantee that what I'm saying is correct."

On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 8:32:51 AM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:25:02 +0200, Steve Hayes
> <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>
> >I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> >phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
> >from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
> >
> >Example of my usage:
> >
> >Me to wife: The printer's not working.
> >Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
> >Me to wife: I'm just saying.
> >
> >Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> >piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
> >it.
> >
> >"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
> >
> >But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
> >saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
> >conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
> >
> >Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> >valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
> >context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
> >I'm just saying."

> To me it means "there's no guarantee that what I'm saying is correct."

To me it can mean that--in which case it may be an attempt to /end/
an argument, not reach a valid conclusion--or it can mean what Steve
and occam said--I'm just giving you this information and you can deal
with it appropriately (which for Steve's printer might mean "Put off
print jobs or make other arrangements" and for occam's might mean
"Take care of this with all deliberate speed.")

--
Jerry Friedman

* Jerry Friedman <617a0fe3-ff0c-4e09-8e23-d0c400d38675n @googlegroups.com> :
Wrote on Sun, 10 Jul 2022 08:40:41 -0700 (PDT):

> On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 8:32:51 AM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:25:02 +0200, Steve Hayes

>> >I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> >phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
>> >from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>> >
>> >Example of my usage:
>> >
>> >Me to wife: The printer's not working.
>> >Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
>> >Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>> >
>> >Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> >piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
>> >it.
>> >
>> >"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>> >
>> >But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
>> >saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
>> >conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>> >
>> >Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>> >valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
>> >context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
>> >I'm just saying."
>> To me it means "there's no guarantee that what I'm saying is correct."

I've not come across this use.

> To me it can mean that--in which case it may be an attempt to /end/
> an argument, not reach a valid conclusion--or it can mean what Steve
> and occam said--I'm just giving you this information and you can deal
> with it appropriately (which for Steve's printer might mean "Put off
> print jobs or make other arrangements" and for occam's might mean
> "Take care of this with all deliberate speed.")

"You may think this is unsolicited but here it is anyway; please dont
think i'm calling for a reaction on your part; i dont care how you use
it"

often with a preposterous remark

On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 08:40:41 -0700 (PDT), Jerry Friedman
<jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 8:32:51 AM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:25:02 +0200, Steve Hayes
>> <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> >phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
>> >from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>> >
>> >Example of my usage:
>> >
>> >Me to wife: The printer's not working.
>> >Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
>> >Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>> >
>> >Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> >piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
>> >it.
>> >
>> >"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>> >
>> >But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
>> >saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
>> >conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>> >
>> >Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>> >valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
>> >context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
>> >I'm just saying."
>
>> To me it means "there's no guarantee that what I'm saying is correct."
>
>To me it can mean that--in which case it may be an attempt to /end/
>an argument, not reach a valid conclusion--or it can mean what Steve
>and occam said--I'm just giving you this information and you can deal
>with it appropriately (which for Steve's printer might mean "Put off
>print jobs or make other arrangements" and for occam's might mean
>"Take care of this with all deliberate speed.")

It seems to be an expression that can be used to mean many things.

To me, it is used when something is pointed out to someone, but it's
not expected that the person will pay much attention to what is
pointed out:

Joe: We could grab a couple of apples from that tree.

Jim: That's old man Smith's tree. That would be trespassing. Just
sayin'.

Jim has pointed out that it would be trespassing to take apples from
Smith's tree, but he doesn't expect that to stop Joe from taking any
apples.

--

Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida

I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 2:52:17 AM UTC-4, Peter Moylan wrote:

> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
> who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".
>
> A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
> which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

I'd say it's equivalent to "FWIW" (for what it's worth). There's
a little factoid for you, having some bearing on some present
circumstance, make of it what you will -- TC and the apple
tree, that is. "No skin off my nose."

On 10-Jul-22 7:52, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 10/07/22 14:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
>> English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>>
>> Example of my usage:
>>
>> Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't
>> know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>>
>> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
>> on it.
>>
>> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>>
>> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
>> philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was
>> not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>>
>> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
>> that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
>> anything, I'm just saying."
>
> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
> who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".
>
> A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
> which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

It sometimes means "Please don't shoot the messenger.".

--
Sam Plusnet

On 10/07/2022 4:25 p.m., Steve Hayes wrote:
> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
> from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>
> Example of my usage:
>
> Me to wife: The printer's not working.
> Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
> Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>
> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
> it.
>
> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>
> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
> saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
> conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>
> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
> context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
> I'm just saying."
>

The way I hear it most often is as a way of disclaiming a conversational
implicature. So in your example, if the normal implicature from a
factual statement such as "The printer's not working" might be: [You
should fix it], but you feel that this would be an unreasonable demand,
or might start a fight, you can avoid it with "Just saying." Of course
the disclaimer works only if the person spoken to accepts it. Pragmatics
is slippery stuff.

So the students if, for example, they concluded in an essay or argument
that "America has too many guns", might add "I'm just saying" as a way
of dissociating themselves from any implied political position or
program of action on the problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implicature

On 2022-07-10 01:06, occam wrote:
> On 10/07/2022 06:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
>> from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>>
>> Example of my usage:
>>
>> Me to wife: The printer's not working.
>> Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
>> Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>>
>> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
>> it.
>
> In my household, that means: "Fix it, tech boy. You know the printer
> lies in your skill-set. You may not have noticed the malfunction, but I
> have."
>
>
>>
>> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>
> Or, alternatively. "I noticed it, and have I brought it to your
> attention. I expect you to do something about it".

That's pretty close to my thoughts. I would describe it as pointing out
something to be considered.

"I'm going to mow the lawn."
"Our dinner reservation is in 15 minutes. 'Just sayin'".

--
The economy is so bad I got a pre-declined credit card in the mail.

On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 12:11:25 -0400
Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 08:40:41 -0700 (PDT), Jerry Friedman
> <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 8:32:51 AM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
> >> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:25:02 +0200, Steve Hayes
> >> <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> >> >phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American English
> >> >from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
> >> >
> >> >Example of my usage:
> >> >
> >> >Me to wife: The printer's not working.
> >> >Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't know what i can do about it.
> >> >Me to wife: I'm just saying.
> >> >
> >> >Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> >> >piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act on
> >> >it.
> >> >
> >> >"I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
> >> >
> >> >But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a philosopher
> >> >saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was not a valid
> >> >conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
> >> >
> >> >Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> >> >valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in that
> >> >context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating anything,
> >> >I'm just saying."
> >
> >> To me it means "there's no guarantee that what I'm saying is correct."
> >
> >To me it can mean that--in which case it may be an attempt to /end/
> >an argument, not reach a valid conclusion--or it can mean what Steve
> >and occam said--I'm just giving you this information and you can deal
> >with it appropriately (which for Steve's printer might mean "Put off
> >print jobs or make other arrangements" and for occam's might mean
> >"Take care of this with all deliberate speed.")
>
> It seems to be an expression that can be used to mean many things.
>
> To me, it is used when something is pointed out to someone, but it's
> not expected that the person will pay much attention to what is
> pointed out:
>
> Joe: We could grab a couple of apples from that tree.
>
> Jim: That's old man Smith's tree. That would be trespassing. Just
> sayin'.
>
> Jim has pointed out that it would be trespassing to take apples from
> Smith's tree, but he doesn't expect that to stop Joe from taking any
> apples.
>
I'd suggest it's also stealin'.Just sayin'.

>
> --
>
> Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida
>
> I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:27:01 -0400, CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 7/10/2022 2:52 AM, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of
>> person who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true". A bit like
>> those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up", which
>> are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".
>
>I think I use it to mean "Please don't read between the lines". I mean
>(or purport to mean*) that I intend none of the implications a hearer
>might otherwise take from what I say.

That's certainly how I use it, but I was told that no one under 50
uses it like that, and that "I'm just sayong" means anything but, and
that it is loaded with implications.

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 21:38:08 +0100, Sam Plusnet <not@home.com> wrote:

>On 10-Jul-22 7:52, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 10/07/22 14:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>>> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
>>> English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>>>
>>> Example of my usage:
>>>
>>> Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't
>>> know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>>>
>>> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>>> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
>>> on it.
>>>
>>> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>>>
>>> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
>>> philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was
>>> not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>>>
>>> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>>> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
>>> that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
>>> anything, I'm just saying."
>>
>> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
>> who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".
>>
>> A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
>> which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".
>
>It sometimes means "Please don't shoot the messenger.".

That I can understand.

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 14:44:04 +1200, Ross Clark <benlizro@ihug.co.nz>
wrote:

>So the students if, for example, they concluded in an essay or argument
>that "America has too many guns", might add "I'm just saying" as a way
>of dissociating themselves from any implied political position or
>program of action on the problem.
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implicature

That sounds very complicated, and almost obfuscature to me.

"Implicate" in MyE carries a lot more cnnotations than "imply"

And does "implicature" mean anything more than "implication"?

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 14:49:00 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

>On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 06:27:01 -0400, CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On 7/10/2022 2:52 AM, Peter Moylan wrote:
>>> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of
>>> person who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true". A bit like
>>> those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up", which
>>> are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".
>>
>>I think I use it to mean "Please don't read between the lines". I mean
>>(or purport to mean*) that I intend none of the implications a hearer
>>might otherwise take from what I say.
>
>That's certainly how I use it, but I was told that no one under 50
>uses it like that, and that "I'm just sayong" means anything but, and
>that it is loaded with implications.

I'm far from being under 50, but I never use it like that, nor do I
use it any other way. I don't use it at all.

On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 2:52:17 AM UTC-4, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 10/07/22 14:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
> > I get the impression from things various people have said that the
> > phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
> > English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
> >
> > Example of my usage:
> >
> > Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't
> > know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.
> >
> > Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
> > piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
> > on it.
> >
> > "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
> >
> > But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
> > philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was
> > not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
> >
> > Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
> > valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
> > that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
> > anything, I'm just saying."
>
> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
> who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".
>
> A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
> which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

What exactly defines a 'conspiracy web site'?

On 2022-07-10, Peter Moylan wrote:

> On 10/07/22 14:25, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> I get the impression from things various people have said that the
>> phrase "I'm just saying" means something different in American
>> English from what it means in my (South African) dialect.
>>
>> Example of my usage:
>>
>> Me to wife: The printer's not working. Wife to me: I'm sorry, I don't
>> know what i can do about it. Me to wife: I'm just saying.
>>
>> Meaning: I dodn't expect you to do anything about it, it's just a
>> piece of information I'm giving you, and I don't expect you to act
>> on it.
>>
>> "I'm just saying" is the oral equivalent of FYI.
>>
>> But someone recently posted a cartoon on social media of a
>> philosopher saying to a group of students that "I'm just saying" was
>> not a valid conclusion to an argument. I was whoooshed.
>>
>> Are there students in America who do think "I'm just saying" IS a
>> valid conclusion to an argument? Because to me it would meen, in
>> that context, "I'm not arguing for anything, I'm not advocating
>> anything, I'm just saying."
>
> This is just a guess, but maybe it was a parody of the sort of person
> who says "I'm telling you, therefore it's true".
>
> A bit like those who write "Do the research" or "You could look it up",
> which are both shorthand for "You need to check the conspiracy web sites".

Cf. "I'm not racist but...."

--
yes, I know the secrets of the circuitry mind
it's a flaming wonder telepath

On 12/07/2022 1:00 a.m., Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 14:44:04 +1200, Ross Clark <benlizro@ihug.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>> So the students if, for example, they concluded in an essay or argument
>> that "America has too many guns", might add "I'm just saying" as a way
>> of dissociating themselves from any implied political position or
>> program of action on the problem.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implicature
>
> That sounds very complicated, and almost obfuscature to me.
>
> "Implicate" in MyE carries a lot more cnnotations than "imply"
>
> And does "implicature" mean anything more than "implication"?
>

I was taking the term from Grice, who apparently invented it. (See the
Wiki article.) He talked about "conversational implicature", and I think
the new word was coined precisely to be different from "implication",
which already had a use in logic (connected to "imply"). And I don't
think "implicate" (meaning involve, with negative connotations) was in
his mind.

On 11-Jul-22 9:10, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Jul 2022 12:11:25 -0400
> Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> wrote:

>> Jim: That's old man Smith's tree. That would be trespassing. Just
>> sayin'.
>>
>> Jim has pointed out that it would be trespassing to take apples from
>> Smith's tree, but he doesn't expect that to stop Joe from taking any
>> apples.
>>
> I'd suggest it's also stealin'.Just sayin'.
>

But that's scrumping, not stealing.

(As someone claimed WIWAL.)

[We need a reference to Middle Dutch at this point.]

--
Sam Plusnet