With the recent flare-up between Hamas and the Israelis, American politicians are forcing China to take the side of Israel.

China should not take side. If China has to show sympathy, it should show it to both sides. If it has to condemn, it should do it to both sides too. But its the European Imperialists, starting with the Romans and ending with the Brits and the French in the past, and presently the Americans, who should be most condemned by the world. They are the root cause of the Palestinian Problem.

The Romans banished and dispersed the Jews from their homeland and renamed it Palestine.

In the mid-600AD, Palestine came under Arab Muslim rule. This was followed by Muslim Ottoman rule, lasting until WW1. Before WW1, the Brits, French and Russians plotted to carve up Ottoman-ruled Middle-East among themselves. During the War, Czarist Imperial Russia crumbled and played no further part in the plot. After the War, with the defeat of the Ottoman, the Brits and the French carved out the Middle East, formed the League of Nations and handed themselves Mandates to rule over parts of the Middle-East. Palestine fell under the British Mandate.

The Jewish Diaspora, mostly in Europe, faced extreme discrimination, persecutions and genocide throughout European history. These caused the Jews in the Diaspora to be conscious of their distinct identity and yearn for the return to their homeland. The Zionist Movement was formed with this aim in mind.

Due to political reasons, the Brits worked with the Zionists to enable Jews from the Diaspora to return to their original homeland, without any regard to the feelings of the Arab Muslims. By then Palestine has been Arab Muslims land for about 1,300 years. This is typical of those European Imperialists. They colonised a land, let in new migrants without regard to the rights of the original inhabitants.

Not surprisingly, the Arab Muslims in Palestine and those in the neighboring countries fought against the Jews. The Brits got cold feet, fled and left the two sides to fight among themselves.

Since then there have been many skirmishes, battles and wars between the Jews and the Arab Muslims in the Middle-East. The current fight between the Hamas and the Israelis is the latest but may not be the last.
The US-led West choose to stand on the side of the Israelis because they are Christian nations. Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism, the religion of the Jews. In the case of the US, another reason is the strong Jewish influence there, especially in politics. The US is deeply involved in the Middle-East conflict, on the side of Israel. The Americans have used their military might to neutralise several Arab Muslims nations which were ardent supporters of the Palestinians. They are namely Egypt, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Anyone of the remainder who dares to stick their neck out for the Palestinians would meet the same fate.

US politicians, one of whom is that stupid Schumer, who press China to sympathise with Israel, should be reminded of the Uighur issue. On that, the Americans sympathise with Uighur Muslims terrorists operating in China, treating them as freedom fighters. Disgusting American double standard!

The Chinese should watch their steps in the Middle-East. If they are not careful, the wrath of the Arab Muslims would be deflected from the US towards China. When that happen, those Arab Muslims fighting with the Uighur Muslims to terrorise China would be regarded and supported as freedom fighters by the Americans.

The Americans have declared a paradigm shift in their global strategy - from Muslim-Christian-Judeao Conflict to that of Big Power Conflict. But the Middle-East remain a splinter stuck in their arse. The Americans want to quit the Middle-East so that they can better contain China in the Asia-Pacific. It is to China's interest to have the Americans bogged down in the Middle-East.

The Americans, on the other hand, want to turn the Muslim World against China. This will ensure their victory in their Big Power Conflict against China.

China should tread carefully in the Middle-East. Don't be fooled by the Americans.

On Thursday, October 12, 2023 at 5:53:10 AM UTC, frodo sam0 wrote:
> With the recent flare-up between Hamas and the Israelis, American politicians are forcing China to take the side of Israel.
>
> China should not take side. If China has to show sympathy, it should show it to both sides. If it has to condemn, it should do it to both sides too. But its the European Imperialists, starting with the Romans and ending with the Brits and the French in the past, and presently the Americans, who should be most condemned by the world. They are the root cause of the Palestinian Problem.
>
> The Romans banished and dispersed the Jews from their homeland and renamed it Palestine.
>
> In the mid-600AD, Palestine came under Arab Muslim rule. This was followed by Muslim Ottoman rule, lasting until WW1. Before WW1, the Brits, French and Russians plotted to carve up Ottoman-ruled Middle-East among themselves.. During the War, Czarist Imperial Russia crumbled and played no further part in the plot. After the War, with the defeat of the Ottoman, the Brits and the French carved out the Middle East, formed the League of Nations and handed themselves Mandates to rule over parts of the Middle-East. Palestine fell under the British Mandate.
>
> The Jewish Diaspora, mostly in Europe, faced extreme discrimination, persecutions and genocide throughout European history. These caused the Jews in the Diaspora to be conscious of their distinct identity and yearn for the return to their homeland. The Zionist Movement was formed with this aim in mind.
>
> Due to political reasons, the Brits worked with the Zionists to enable Jews from the Diaspora to return to their original homeland, without any regard to the feelings of the Arab Muslims. By then Palestine has been Arab Muslims land for about 1,300 years. This is typical of those European Imperialists. They colonised a land, let in new migrants without regard to the rights of the original inhabitants.
>
> Not surprisingly, the Arab Muslims in Palestine and those in the neighboring countries fought against the Jews. The Brits got cold feet, fled and left the two sides to fight among themselves.
>
> Since then there have been many skirmishes, battles and wars between the Jews and the Arab Muslims in the Middle-East. The current fight between the Hamas and the Israelis is the latest but may not be the last.
> The US-led West choose to stand on the side of the Israelis because they are Christian nations. Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism, the religion of the Jews. In the case of the US, another reason is the strong Jewish influence there, especially in politics. The US is deeply involved in the Middle-East conflict, on the side of Israel. The Americans have used their military might to neutralise several Arab Muslims nations which were ardent supporters of the Palestinians. They are namely Egypt, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Anyone of the remainder who dares to stick their neck out for the Palestinians would meet the same fate.
>
> US politicians, one of whom is that stupid Schumer, who press China to sympathise with Israel, should be reminded of the Uighur issue. On that, the Americans sympathise with Uighur Muslims terrorists operating in China, treating them as freedom fighters. Disgusting American double standard!
>
> The Chinese should watch their steps in the Middle-East. If they are not careful, the wrath of the Arab Muslims would be deflected from the US towards China. When that happen, those Arab Muslims fighting with the Uighur Muslims to terrorise China would be regarded and supported as freedom fighters by the Americans.
>
> The Americans have declared a paradigm shift in their global strategy - from Muslim-Christian-Judeao Conflict to that of Big Power Conflict. But the Middle-East remain a splinter stuck in their arse. The Americans want to quit the Middle-East so that they can better contain China in the Asia-Pacific. It is to China's interest to have the Americans bogged down in the Middle-East.
>
> The Americans, on the other hand, want to turn the Muslim World against China. This will ensure their victory in their Big Power Conflict against China.
>
> China should tread carefully in the Middle-East. Don't be fooled by the Americans.

However much one may want to sympathise with the Palestinians, theirs is a losing cause.
Look at their changing fortunes.
Initially, neighboring Arab Muslims nations like Egypt, Libya, Syria, Jordan and Iraq fought together with them. That failed.
Then they fought the Israelis under a single entity of PLO. This failed too.
Now we have the Hamas, which is a small faction of the PLO. They are no match against the Israelis. Without help, the Hamas will become extinct.
After Hamas, what's left?
Egypt has recognised the existence of the State of Israel. The PLO has vowed to keep the peace with Israel.
Jordan is more beholden to the West than the Arab World.
Iraq, Libya and Syria are all struggling to keep themselves in one piece.
Who's left to fight for the Palestinians?
Iran? Iranians may be Muslims but they are not Arabs. Would they risk losing their nation to fight and die for the Arab Palestinians?
The ending for the Palestinians will be a sad one. Like the Jews before them, the Palestinians will become a diaspora yearning for their lost homeland..

On Saturday, October 14, 2023 at 4:24:33 AM UTC, decadence thlon wrote:

> However much one may want to sympathise with the Palestinians, theirs is a losing cause.
> Look at their changing fortunes.
> Initially, neighboring Arab Muslims nations like Egypt, Libya, Syria, Jordan and Iraq fought together with them. That failed.
> Then they fought the Israelis under a single entity of PLO. This failed too.
> Now we have the Hamas, which is a small faction of the PLO. They are no match against the Israelis. Without help, the Hamas will become extinct.
> After Hamas, what's left?
> Egypt has recognised the existence of the State of Israel. The PLO has vowed to keep the peace with Israel.
> Jordan is more beholden to the West than the Arab World.
> Iraq, Libya and Syria are all struggling to keep themselves in one piece.
> Who's left to fight for the Palestinians?

The Jewish people got Jesus killed. In response, Western Christian nations had a thousand year long
anti-Jew tradition cumulated with the Holocust. History changed direction and Palestinians become
the victim.

The current narrative: Anti-Nazism means Making Israel Safe and Great Again..

> Iran? Iranians may be Muslims but they are not Arabs. Would they risk losing their nation to fight and die for the Arab Palestinians?
> The ending for the Palestinians will be a sad one. Like the Jews before them, the Palestinians will become a diaspora yearning for their lost homeland.

On Saturday, October 14, 2023 at 4:24:33 AM UTC, decadence thlon wrote:
> On Thursday, October 12, 2023 at 5:53:10 AM UTC, frodo sam0 wrote:
> > With the recent flare-up between Hamas and the Israelis, American politicians are forcing China to take the side of Israel.
> >
> > China should not take side. If China has to show sympathy, it should show it to both sides. If it has to condemn, it should do it to both sides too. But its the European Imperialists, starting with the Romans and ending with the Brits and the French in the past, and presently the Americans, who should be most condemned by the world. They are the root cause of the Palestinian Problem.
> >
> > The Romans banished and dispersed the Jews from their homeland and renamed it Palestine.
> >
> > In the mid-600AD, Palestine came under Arab Muslim rule. This was followed by Muslim Ottoman rule, lasting until WW1. Before WW1, the Brits, French and Russians plotted to carve up Ottoman-ruled Middle-East among themselves. During the War, Czarist Imperial Russia crumbled and played no further part in the plot. After the War, with the defeat of the Ottoman, the Brits and the French carved out the Middle East, formed the League of Nations and handed themselves Mandates to rule over parts of the Middle-East. Palestine fell under the British Mandate.
> >
> > The Jewish Diaspora, mostly in Europe, faced extreme discrimination, persecutions and genocide throughout European history. These caused the Jews in the Diaspora to be conscious of their distinct identity and yearn for the return to their homeland. The Zionist Movement was formed with this aim in mind.
> >
> > Due to political reasons, the Brits worked with the Zionists to enable Jews from the Diaspora to return to their original homeland, without any regard to the feelings of the Arab Muslims. By then Palestine has been Arab Muslims land for about 1,300 years. This is typical of those European Imperialists. They colonised a land, let in new migrants without regard to the rights of the original inhabitants.
> >
> > Not surprisingly, the Arab Muslims in Palestine and those in the neighboring countries fought against the Jews. The Brits got cold feet, fled and left the two sides to fight among themselves.
> >
> > Since then there have been many skirmishes, battles and wars between the Jews and the Arab Muslims in the Middle-East. The current fight between the Hamas and the Israelis is the latest but may not be the last.
> > The US-led West choose to stand on the side of the Israelis because they are Christian nations. Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism, the religion of the Jews. In the case of the US, another reason is the strong Jewish influence there, especially in politics. The US is deeply involved in the Middle-East conflict, on the side of Israel. The Americans have used their military might to neutralise several Arab Muslims nations which were ardent supporters of the Palestinians. They are namely Egypt, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Anyone of the remainder who dares to stick their neck out for the Palestinians would meet the same fate.
> >
> > US politicians, one of whom is that stupid Schumer, who press China to sympathise with Israel, should be reminded of the Uighur issue. On that, the Americans sympathise with Uighur Muslims terrorists operating in China, treating them as freedom fighters. Disgusting American double standard!
> >
> > The Chinese should watch their steps in the Middle-East. If they are not careful, the wrath of the Arab Muslims would be deflected from the US towards China. When that happen, those Arab Muslims fighting with the Uighur Muslims to terrorise China would be regarded and supported as freedom fighters by the Americans.
> >
> > The Americans have declared a paradigm shift in their global strategy - from Muslim-Christian-Judeao Conflict to that of Big Power Conflict. But the Middle-East remain a splinter stuck in their arse. The Americans want to quit the Middle-East so that they can better contain China in the Asia-Pacific. It is to China's interest to have the Americans bogged down in the Middle-East.
> >
> > The Americans, on the other hand, want to turn the Muslim World against China. This will ensure their victory in their Big Power Conflict against China.
> >
> > China should tread carefully in the Middle-East. Don't be fooled by the Americans.
> However much one may want to sympathise with the Palestinians, theirs is a losing cause.
> Look at their changing fortunes.
> Initially, neighboring Arab Muslims nations like Egypt, Libya, Syria, Jordan and Iraq fought together with them. That failed.
> Then they fought the Israelis under a single entity of PLO. This failed too.
> Now we have the Hamas, which is a small faction of the PLO. They are no match against the Israelis. Without help, the Hamas will become extinct.
> After Hamas, what's left?
> Egypt has recognised the existence of the State of Israel. The PLO has vowed to keep the peace with Israel.
> Jordan is more beholden to the West than the Arab World.
> Iraq, Libya and Syria are all struggling to keep themselves in one piece.
> Who's left to fight for the Palestinians?
> Iran? Iranians may be Muslims but they are not Arabs. Would they risk losing their nation to fight and die for the Arab Palestinians?
> The ending for the Palestinians will be a sad one. Like the Jews before them, the Palestinians will become a diaspora yearning for their lost homeland.

How will it all end?

Two-state solution is passe. It was offerred by the UN in 1947. The Palestinians and their fellow Arabs rejected it. They opted for war. And lost. After a series of wars, Israel has gained much territories from Palestine.

In the two-state solution, what would the sovereign territory of each state be? The 1947’s as drawn up by the UN? The one after the 1948 War? Or the one after the 1967 War? Or the one after the 1973 War? Will the Israelis agree to it knowing how hard they had fought and how much sacrifices they had made to gain those territories?

A two-state solution now will result in two states constantly at war with each other.

Why are Israelis striking back so hard? This generation of Jews know what their forebears have been through. Their forebears humiliations and sufferings are etched deeply on the mind of present day Jews. It is not surprising if the Jews have little faith or trust left in their fellow human beings. Today, when Jews are being attacked, it triggers their survival instinct.

Their motto is simply this: Never Again!

This explains why their reaction to an attack is a much stronger counterattack.

The solution to the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict is to let them fight it out until there is a clear winner. The losers will have to leave or subject themselves to domination by the winner.

This is how the present day world comes about - after many local and regional wars and two world wars. Each nation’s territory is intact today only because it can be defended, by itself, or with the support of more powerful nation(s). Look at some of the other territorial disputes existing today.

Ukraine
Northern Ireland
Falklands
Gibraltar
Guantanamo Bay in Cuba
Nargano-Karabakh between Armenia and Azerbaijan
Jammu-Kashmir
North-eastern states of India
Himalayan Border of India and China
Islets in the South China Sea

Each one of them can deteriorate into full-scale war.

In the Israel-Palestine Conflict, the victor is emerging. With each fight, the Israelis are emerging as the indisputable victor. The latest conflict may well be the last, with Israel as the final victor.

Lastly, in war, the side that harms innocent civilians should be condemned, doesn’t matter which side does it first and which side does it in response.