"More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other year on record, according to recently published statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population – remains below the levels of earlier years.
....
The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record, representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."

The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?

Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:

https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200

Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles traveled is taken into account.

On Friday, August 12, 2022 at 1:29:55 PM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> "More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other year on record, according to recently published statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population – remains below the levels of earlier years.
> ...
> The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record, representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."
>
> The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?
>
> Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:
>
> https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200
>
> Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles traveled is taken into account.
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/02/03/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/

ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other
> year on record, according to recently published statistics from the
> Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a
> record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun
> suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun
> deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population
> – remains below the levels of earlier years.
> ...
> The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record,
> representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from
> five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."
>
> The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?
>
> Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:
>
> https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200
>
> Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The
> decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles
> traveled is taken into account.

Could you compare total number suicides *per million people* and number
of killings? [More usanesse => more death ]

I can not see what makes suicide/killing by gun worse than suicide by
other means.

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mahatma_Gandhi
> Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will
> look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest. If
> we want the Arms Act to be repealed, if we want to learn the use of
> arms, here is a golden opportunity. If the middle classes render
> voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial, distrust will
> disappear, and the ban on possessing arms will be withdrawn.
> From a leaflet urging Indians to serve with the British Army in
> World War I, Part V, Chapter 27, Recruiting Campaign

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| If you really want pure ASCII, save it as text... or browse it with
| your favorite browser... (Alexandre Maret <amaret@infomaniak.ch>)

On Friday, August 12, 2022 at 2:38:02 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> ltlee1 wrote:
> > "More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other
> > year on record, according to recently published statistics from the
> > Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a
> > record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun
> > suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun
> > deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population
> > – remains below the levels of earlier years.
> > ...
> > The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record,
> > representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from
> > five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."
> >
> > The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?
> >
> > Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:
> >
> > https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200
> >
> > Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The
> > decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles
> > traveled is taken into account.
> Could you compare total number suicides *per million people* and number
> of killings? [More usanesse => more death ]
>
> I can not see what makes suicide/killing by gun worse than suicide by
> other means.

Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:

"American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
to a new survey from Monmouth University.

"About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.

And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.

The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/

>
> https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mahatma_Gandhi
> > Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will
> > look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest. If
> > we want the Arms Act to be repealed, if we want to learn the use of
> > arms, here is a golden opportunity. If the middle classes render
> > voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial, distrust will
> > disappear, and the ban on possessing arms will be withdrawn.
> > From a leaflet urging Indians to serve with the British Army in
> > World War I, Part V, Chapter 27, Recruiting Campaign
>
> --
> A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
> | If you really want pure ASCII, save it as text... or browse it with
> | your favorite browser... (Alexandre Maret <ama...@infomaniak.ch>)

ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Friday, August 12, 2022 at 2:38:02 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
>> ltlee1 wrote:
>> > "More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other
>> > year on record, according to recently published statistics from the
>> > Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a
>> > record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun
>> > suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun
>> > deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population
>> > – remains below the levels of earlier years.
>> > ...
>> > The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record,
>> > representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from
>> > five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."
>> >
>> > The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?
>> >
>> > Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:
>> >
>> > https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200
>> >
>> > Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The
>> > decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles
>> > traveled is taken into account.
>> Could you compare total number suicides *per million people* and number
>> of killings? [More usanesse => more death ]
>>
>> I can not see what makes suicide/killing by gun worse than suicide by
>> other means.
>> […]
>
> Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
> Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
> What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
> political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:
>
> "American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
> a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
> to a new survey from Monmouth University.
>
> "About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
> to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.
>
> And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
> in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
> dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.
>
> The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
> topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
> percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
> https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/

Politically the issue is simple (after translation to US political realities):
How much more *federal* gun control is required?
What is needed *at federal level* beyond laws about transporting firearms
*over state lines*?

Translated to China/PRC perspective: Is more US federal powers in PRC interest?
Rants about "bad USA" are frequently in PRC interest ;-)

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| If your happiness depends on what somebody else does, I guess you
| do have a problem. (Richard Bach, "Illusions")

On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Friday, August 12, 2022 at 2:38:02 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> >> ltlee1 wrote:
> >> > "More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2020 than in any other
> >> > year on record, according to recently published statistics from the
> >> > Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). That included a
> >> > record number of gun murders, as well as a near-record number of gun
> >> > suicides. Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun
> >> > deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation’s growing population
> >> > – remains below the levels of earlier years.
> >> > ...
> >> > The 45,222 total gun deaths in 2020 were by far the most on record,
> >> > representing a 14% increase from the year before, a 25% increase from
> >> > five years earlier and a 43% increase from a decade prior."
> >> >
> >> > The report also points out the number of gun death is below the levels of earlier years as if it is a redeeming feature. Is it?
> >> >
> >> > Let us compare with other no biology related, and therefore more responsive to government policy, death:
> >> >
> >> > https://i.insider.com/5717dbc452bcd025008bde4a?width=1200
> >> >
> >> > Traffic death shows a general trend of decreases over time. The
> >> > decreasing trend is more drastic when the number of vehicular miles
> >> > traveled is taken into account.
> >> Could you compare total number suicides *per million people* and number
> >> of killings? [More usanesse => more death ]
> >>
> >> I can not see what makes suicide/killing by gun worse than suicide by
> >> other means.
> >> […]
> >
> > Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
> > Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
> > What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
> > political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:
> >
> > "American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
> > a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
> > to a new survey from Monmouth University.
> >
> > "About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
> > to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.
> >
> > And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
> > in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
> > dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.
> >
> > The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
> > topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
> > percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
> > https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/
> Politically the issue is simple (after translation to US political realities):
> How much more *federal* gun control is required?
> What is needed *at federal level* beyond laws about transporting firearms
> *over state lines*?
>
> Translated to China/PRC perspective: Is more US federal powers in PRC interest?
> Rants about "bad USA" are frequently in PRC interest ;-)

To what degree is gun ownership (or gun control and associated gun death) is a matter
of democratic freedom or democratic incompetence?

--
> A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
> | If your happiness depends on what somebody else does, I guess you
> | do have a problem. (Richard Bach, "Illusions")

ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
>> ltlee1 wrote:
[...]
>> > Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
>> > Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
>> > What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
>> > political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:
>> >
>> > "American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
>> > a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
>> > to a new survey from Monmouth University.
>> >
>> > "About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
>> > to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.
>> >
>> > And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
>> > in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
>> > dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.
>> >
>> > The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
>> > topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
>> > percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
>> > https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/
>> Politically the issue is simple (after translation to US political realities):
>> How much more *federal* gun control is required?
>> What is needed *at federal level* beyond laws about transporting firearms
>> *over state lines*?
>>
>> Translated to China/PRC perspective: Is more US federal powers in PRC interest?
>> Rants about "bad USA" are frequently in PRC interest ;-)
>
> To what degree is gun ownership (or gun control and associated gun death) is a matter
> of democratic freedom or democratic incompetence?

Disarmed citizens of PRC are much less dangerous to CPC leadership,
aren't they? Is it a matter of undemocratic competence?
Life is a game of achieving a few (partially) contradictory goals at once.
You seems to see *ONLY* the single goal.
Too little and too much salt is harmful.

--
A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
| Never underestimate the power of human stupidity.
| (Robert A. Heinlein)

On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 8:27:50 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> >> ltlee1 wrote:
> [...]
> >> > Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
> >> > Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
> >> > What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
> >> > political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:
> >> >
> >> > "American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
> >> > a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
> >> > to a new survey from Monmouth University.
> >> >
> >> > "About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
> >> > to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.
> >> >
> >> > And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
> >> > in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
> >> > dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.
> >> >
> >> > The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
> >> > topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
> >> > percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
> >> > https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/
> >> Politically the issue is simple (after translation to US political realities):
> >> How much more *federal* gun control is required?
> >> What is needed *at federal level* beyond laws about transporting firearms
> >> *over state lines*?
> >>
> >> Translated to China/PRC perspective: Is more US federal powers in PRC interest?
> >> Rants about "bad USA" are frequently in PRC interest ;-)
> >
> > To what degree is gun ownership (or gun control and associated gun death) is a matter
> > of democratic freedom or democratic incompetence?
> Disarmed citizens of PRC are much less dangerous to CPC leadership,

"Disarmed citizens everywhere are in general less dangerous to themselves and to
their leaders." No?

> aren't they? Is it a matter of undemocratic competence?
Is preserving citizen's lives an important goal?
IF yes, competent government and democratic government
is the two sides of the same coin.
IF no, is such government really democratic.

> Life is a game of achieving a few (partially) contradictory goals at once..

Totally agree.
American voters are indeed wanting to achieve contradictory goals. The issue
where to draw the line differentiating democratic freedom and democratic
competence. And more important, however the line is drawn, is it not always
SUBJECTIVE per the people and their leaders?
And therefore cannot be UNIVERSALLY applied. There is American democratic
freedom at certain time, t, could always be viewed as democratic incompetence
at some other time and some other places.

> You seems to see *ONLY* the single goal.
> Too little and too much salt is harmful.
Again, what you and I see is irrelevant.
In contrast, what American leaders decided on gun freedom would get
more or less gun death in the US.

> --
> A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
> | Never underestimate the power of human stupidity.
> | (Robert A. Heinlein)

On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 9:02:19 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 8:27:50 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > ltlee1 wrote:
> > > On Saturday, August 13, 2022 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
> > >> ltlee1 wrote:
> > [...]
> > >> > Again, gun death and the necessity for control is not any kind of personal issue.
> > >> > Rather it is an American issue per American voters. What you or I think is irrelevant.
> > >> > What matter is the ongoing political culture and how it is different from other nations'
> > >> > political culture. In case you are not familiar with the US, try the following:
> > >> >
> > >> > "American voters are more concerned about gun control policies now than they were
> > >> > a few months ago, before a series of deadly mass shootings rocked the nation, according
> > >> > to a new survey from Monmouth University.
> > >> >
> > >> > "About 38 percent of Americans say gun control is an “extremely important” issue, according
> > >> > to the survey, up from 32 percent in May.
> > >> >
> > >> > And the proportion of voters surveyed who say it is “somewhat important” fell from 21 percent
> > >> > in May to 14 percent in August, while respondents who agree gun control is “not important”
> > >> > dropped from 12 percent in May to 10 percent in August.
> > >> >
> > >> > The polling comes about three months out from the November midterm elections. The economy
> > >> > topped the list of the most pressing issues for voters surveyed ahead of Election Day, with 24
> > >> > percent agreeing that it was the most important concern for them."
> > >> > https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3586233-voters-focus-on-gun-policy-rises-survey/
> > >> Politically the issue is simple (after translation to US political realities):
> > >> How much more *federal* gun control is required?
> > >> What is needed *at federal level* beyond laws about transporting firearms
> > >> *over state lines*?
> > >>
> > >> Translated to China/PRC perspective: Is more US federal powers in PRC interest?
> > >> Rants about "bad USA" are frequently in PRC interest ;-)
> > >
> > > To what degree is gun ownership (or gun control and associated gun death) is a matter
> > > of democratic freedom or democratic incompetence?
> > Disarmed citizens of PRC are much less dangerous to CPC leadership,
> "Disarmed citizens everywhere are in general less dangerous to themselves and to
> their leaders." No?
> > aren't they? Is it a matter of undemocratic competence?
> Is preserving citizen's lives an important goal?
> IF yes, competent government and democratic government
> is the two sides of the same coin.
> IF no, is such government really democratic.
> > Life is a game of achieving a few (partially) contradictory goals at once.
> Totally agree.
> American voters are indeed wanting to achieve contradictory goals. The issue
> where to draw the line differentiating democratic freedom and democratic
> competence. And more important, however the line is drawn, is it not always
> SUBJECTIVE per the people and their leaders?
> And therefore cannot be UNIVERSALLY applied. There is American democratic
> freedom at certain time, t, could always be viewed as democratic incompetence
> at some other time and some other places.
> > You seems to see *ONLY* the single goal.
> > Too little and too much salt is harmful.
> Again, what you and I see is irrelevant.
> In contrast, what American leaders decided on gun freedom would get
> more or less gun death in the US.

If one doesn't treat Western democracy as an matter of faith and remain observant,
it is clear all government polices inevitably involve what the people CANNOT DO.

In other words all government policies are points along a policy spectrum with
Democratic freedom on one end and Democratic incompetence on the other end.

The balance point or the optimal point is always a matter to be decided by the
people. And people could very well consider a certain point P democratic freedom
at time T and consider the same point P democratic incompetence at some other
time.

True democracy has little to do on where is point P but satisfying the people view
where the balance/optimal point should lie.